The words that have been pulled over your eyes

[FlirtsWithRhinos]

I initially wrote this as a reply to a thread in relationships, but rather than derail the thread I decided to post it in FWR as a thread in its own right about a common accusation made against gender critical feminists.

It is a response to the claim that the only people who object to the word "cis" are people who deny the existence of trans women, and that such people are transphobes.

"Transphobe", like "trans woman" and indeed "cis woman", are just the words trans activists use to hide what is really going on.

These words exist to hide one simple truth: Trans women are not, in any objective, real way, in any way outside their own heads, in any way that is real to anyone else, any closer to being a woman than any other man is.

"Trans women" in reality are just men who for some reason feel compelled (or sometimes just really want ) to adopt a cross-sex persona playing out whatever their idea of what a woman is.

The words exist to make it sound like a reasonable thing when such men demand that their wives, children, friends and family, colleagues, officials, all of society pretend they are women, let them enter private spaces for women, let them touch or counsel women in roles reserved for women, let them take prizes for women, let them speak for women.

Because we'd never accept that as ok from men. But it's ok for trans women, and if it's not ok that's transphobia.

And we'd never say women in general are more privileged and powerful than men, but call the men trans women and the women cis women and suddenly everyone nods along. And if they don't it's transphobia.

But I don't believe the thing that makes men and women different is our minds. And without that belief, the whole thing falls apart.

I cannot fathom someone putting so much energy into any of this if they are not trans.
It bothers me how bothered some of you are about other people’s genitalia.
I cannot imagine spending so much of my time thinking about this.
Creepy AF.

If you can’t fathom it then you’ve not read enough of the threads on here. I recommend you do so.

From this you appear to be either male or a woman, possibly youngish, without personal experience of VAWG.

It's not all about the genitalia.

But I don't believe the thing that makes men and women different is our minds. And without that belief, the whole thing falls apart.

This!

This is it in a nutshell.

"I cannot fathom someone putting so much energy into any of this if they are not trans."

Dr Az Hakeem, who has worked with people identifying as trans for decades, has come across too many people who went as far as bottom surgery only to realise they were not trans. Turns out there are quite a few reasons to ask for such treatments besides gender dysphoria.

What makes someone trans or not trans @Britinme?

And yet people like you are always the ones to bring up genitalia in the first place.

It’s hard not to when you have experienced male violence, including rape. It has a habit of creeping into your mind most days.

Exactly, that’s what I find to be creepy.

I think this response typifies the narcissism of TRAs. People aren’t obsessed with other people’s genitalia. People are worried about their own safe spaces being encroached on and their own rights being trampled

But why the obsession with trans women? It's not as if they are the only ones who might commit violence but they're made out to be the big bad bogeys. Yes there are some trans women ( who possibly only decided they were trans when faced with prison) who have done awful things but the vast majority are done by the average man.

Because they are males claiming the right to access women's services and spaces.

Because they are men

We've got safe spaces now after the SC ruling but still the trans women fixation continues. Why not talk about trans men for a change, I'm sure some of them are wrong uns.

Well, not anymore they cant

That is possibly true, but the power differential is totally different.

Women are not the threat to men that that men are to women.

That's not very difficult to understand, is it? Why do you think you have trouble with it?

Imagination.

Transmen are female.

Fundamental misunderstanding here: no one is interested in the men, or any part of them. They are interested in the women that those men impact upon, and upon the equalities and legal rights of those women to live lives unimpeded by those men.

Not everything, all the time is about men. Not everything women think and do revolves around men.

Why not actually talk about the average man then (i.e not trans) instead of trans women all the time. There's a lot more needs doing in regard to mens behaviour in general without just zeroing in on trans women

That would be because those men are not in daily effort to destroy women's rights and equalities in law and in practice.

Yes but surely some of them have done bad things too. That would be interesting for a change

Because the average man doesn't think he has a right to women's spaces.

Again, not hard to figure that distinction out, so why is this such a struggle for you I wonder?

The average man isn’t trying to force their way into women’s space.

If you think feminists don’t talk about anything else you are mistaken

Really?