Two biological men a day given trans surgery on the NHS

[hholiday]

I couldn’t see this had been posted already. From the Telegraph with an interview with a detransitioner. Some of these patients were just so, so young.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/05/25/two-biological-men-a-day-given-trans-surgery-on-nhs/

archive.is/EcAqN

Then pay again for reversal when they decide it’s not for them.

I know I’m preaching to the choir here, but surely there is no being transgender/transsexual/trans without the medical diagnosis of gender dysphoria?

what is there to treat if there is no dysphoria?

Mostly fake tits I expect.

It's the same in my country. "We want to get a long-time affection status, but we don't want to be pathologised, but we want the Sécurité Sociale to pay for all our treatments, but we're not sick!" And I'm in my corner, facepalming hard...

There isn't anything to "treat", that's the point. It's compared (inaccurately, in my view) to being gay.

I think this is where we disagree. There is nothing to treat without gender dysphoria, but I believe it can be treated through transition for those who are really suffering from GD and have other conditions well controlled

I have FF cup breasts on a 5’’ 2” size 8 frame. I cannot buy clothes to fit. I have lots of falls, which I am sure is due to the weight of them. I have back ache every day. My bra straps have deformed my shoulders, I have huge dips in the bone structure, big enough to completely take the width and depth of my ring finger.

I was ridiculed at school, and that has continued as an adult. They stop me exercising. I auditioned for the Royal Ballet school, but even at eleven I was told my breasts were too big.

I have begged for a reduction, been refused every time.
I know that in comparison to those waiting for heart surgery etc this seems minor, but this has blighted my life, and at 55 is still doing so, yet we have an NHS mutilating young people every day, fully paid for, and they have not even been given therapy first as that is seen as conversion therapy, and the therapist risks being struck off.
In every way this is heartbreaking.

I found a lovely example of someone intending to get their ‘money’s worth’ from the NHS. This is an extract from a ‘transfer’s’ Instagram account - I’ve not identified them and they’ve recently changed the name of their account but it was posted in the past week. Thought it was pertinent to this thread.

@ScoldsBridal
Has to lose weight before surgery so that he doesn't die under general anaesthetic. Transphobia and fatphobia, apparently. Oh, the Victimhood!

Sorry my image is awaiting approval but the pertinent comment was:

“I might be leaving the country next year but I’m going to rinse the NHS of everything I can get first because my god I deserve it after everything they’ve put me and my trans siblings through”

They then proceed to wish their privately paid-for ‘tits’ a happy birthday - they’re called ‘Madonna’ and ‘Who’re’.

If these surgeries were not offered on the NHS, far fewer would be performed, and young lives would not be irreparably damaged.

Exactly
Some wait years
Three years for 15 % of women in nhs Grampian ! and this isn’t isolated.

There’s a lengthy piece on this topic here (focuses on men).
https://mungeribabu.substack.com/p/estrogen-is-really-bad-for-men

Covers both the drugs and the surgery; many links and references.

I obviously missed the news headline that the nhs had loads of money. When did that happen.

Gender dysphoria? Even if surgery could be considered a rational treatment for a psychological condition. Or body integrity disorder? Or something else...hmm...what might induce a man to get breast implants and then name them sexist, misogynistic names?

But, no, of course not! No way would the NHS spend precious resources supporting expression of a fetish.

Surely not?

Meanwhile, women who have had single mastectomy for cancer can only have cosmetic surgery to replace the lost breast, but not to modify the remaining breast for symmetry and comfort.

Seems to match the number of "gender affirming" surgeries on women.

More than 1,000 patients a year have trans chest surgery on the NHS
Data reveal the extent of ‘masculinising’ mastectomies being carried out on the health service, despite calls to halt the surgeries
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/10/revealed-thousands-of-trans-surgeries-carried-out-by-nhs/
and https://archive.is/A9m2x

You misunderstood me.
You asked "what is there to treat if there is no dysphoria?" and i said nothing. You appear to agree with that.

This is now an outdated view. Trans (which includes transvestites/crossdressers) is not a medical condition, but an identity.

In children, although it's an identity, it's also considered to be a medical condition, and it's claimed by many transactivists that it's important that children have medical treatment as soon as puberty starts.

Adults can opt for either the totally medicalised path or the totally unmedicalised path, or a mix if the two, taking whatever they want to suit their own personal tastes and desires. Whether they should be viewed as victims suffering from a distressing psychological condition, or people with an identity which is comparable to being gay, is also dependent their own whims.

Some of these people have what you're thinking of as gender dysphoria. They desire medication and surgery to make their bodies look as much as possible like the opposite sex. These are the people you seem to be thinking of, but there are now many different reasons for adopting a trans identity which you seem unaware of.

Some males who identify as trans are just crossdressers taking their fetish to an extreme. Some of these also desire medical transformation to make their bodies look female. This is autogynephilia.

Some of these men recognise that their sexual fulfillment means that they need to keep their sexual organs. These are the men who claim to be women with penises. They don't have gender dysphoria and they don't want medical treatment other than possibly fake breasts or cosmetic facial surgery. They are still under the trans umbrella.

Not in the UK afaik. They tried to make apotemnophilia a thing in the 1990s like transgenderism but luckily they failed. I don’t quite understand why the two conditions are treated so differently. Arguably removing or altering someone’s healthy genitalia is far more harmful than an arm or a leg. Complications of the urinary function can and has lead to death.

It's interesting that the two conditions are treated so differently, since they are obviously so similar, and some people have both conditions (like Chloe Jennings White).

This article from 2000 discusses the similarity.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2000/12/a-new-way-to-be-mad/304671/

Since then it's become less acceptable to compare the two conditions and even to view gender dysphoria/ transgenderism as a mental disorder.

If it's for health reasons eg very large breasts causing severe back pain yes. If it's for purely cosmetic reasons then they should go private imo.

What about post cancer?

The question I answered was about breast reduction, not mastectomy or any other type of cancer (I'm not sure what cancer you're referring to).
If someone has had breast cancer and they've had a mastectomy there's nothing left to reduce. If they've had a lumpectomy or any other type of cancer other than breast cancer, then I think my same original answer would apply.

Whataboutery involving cancer is never a good look.

Surely it goes against "do no harm" to multilate someone based on a belief.
We wouldn't operate on someone with schizophrenia who has the crawling feeling in their eyes, because whilst it may make them feel better emotionally it would be doing physical harm.