NHS Policy Audit - working party

[KnottyAuty]

Following on from Thread #23 of the Peggie v NHS Employment Tribunal. Anyone who wants to help with survey/audit of paperwork against the Equality Act protected characteristics please join here 😊

Thank you all!
Ive just been helping DS with his homework so I’ll now get on this and check the survey to see what’s missing - you have all been so efficient! Twice as many trusts in half the time - love it 😍

And big shout out to Ermine / @SeaStoat we couldn’t have done e it without you xx

I have started NE London and should get that finished tomorrow.

Hello - just checked in to the Jotform and there are 8 still to come and from my scribblings I've tried to note who is doing what - feel free to offload/swap as you wish:

@SqueakyDinosaur Great Ormond Street Hospital For Children NHS Foundation Trust

@YellowRoom Homerton Healthcare NHS Foundation Trust

@ThatPithySheep Hounslow and Richmond Community Healthcare NHS Trust

@FarriersGirl or @KnottyAuty I can do it - North East London NHS Foundation Trust

And for some reason I have not managed to allocate these 4 - all the names seem to similar - any takers please?

King’s College Hospital NHS Foundation Trust - @FarriersGirl ?

London North West University Healthcare NHS Trust - @withthegreatestrespect ?

West London NHS Trust - @umbel ?

Whittington Health NHS Trust - @Cantunseeit ?

@KnottyAuty
London North West University Healthcare NHS Trust. I'll get right on it!

....and within 30 seconds:

Same sex accommodation
We aim to accommodate all patients in same sex accommodation where possible. We will aim to assign accommodation based on gender identity and presentation.

Seems like most of the London trusts use this exact wording - did we find the original source (I have lost track)?

I've submitted UCLH and should get Homerton done by tomorrow.

Thought this was interesting -
''Particular considerations for children and young people
Gender variant children and young people should be accorded the same respect for their self defined gender as are trans adults, regardless of their genital gender... Where segregation is deemed necessary, it should be in accordance with the dress, preferred name and/or stated gender identity of the child or young person. In some instances, parents or those with parental responsibility may have a view that is not consistent with the child’s view. If possible, the child’s preference should prevail even if the child is not Gillick competent.''

That was word-for-word in CNWLondon trust too! I nearly posted the “even if not Gillick competent” on here because it seemed so egregious.

These are def all coming from the same source document.

The Gillick bit is NHS England Annex B
www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/05/NEW-Delivering_same_sex_accommodation_sep2019.pdf

Lovely, thank you!

In that document there is a reference to the following document, which has been withdrawn:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6613f341eb8a1b8fae05e317/WITHDRAWN_Providing_services_for_transgender_customers-a_guide.pdf

which includes the statement:

A trans person should be free to select the facilities (such as toilets or changing rooms) appropriate to the gender in which they present.

I’m going to go look at the document that has replaced this one. Brb.

This is the page that the withdrawn “Providing services” document was linked from:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/providing-services-for-transgender-customers-a-guide

As of 8 April 2024, this page now signposts to the following:

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/equality/equality-act-2010/separate-and-single-sex-service-providers-guide-equality-act-sex-and

This new document is extremely clear about what constitutes single sex spaces and there are copious examples of when it is lawful and appropriate to exclude trans-identified men from women’s services.

Yes @KnottyAuty I can take Whittington Health NHS Trust. Please can you send me the link to the jot form/ instructions? This will be my first go 🙏

I've submitted Homerton Healthcare - their website/transparency sucks.

If it wasn't for @SeaStoat I'd have f all

West London NHS Trust? On it tomorrow morning!

If we are acknowledging the efforts of those who have trod this path before us, special thanks should go to Cleo Madeleine from Gender GP who sent a batch of 202 of these enquiries back in 2021. Now works for Gendered Intelligence, but regardless, sterling work, my man, sterling work!

I have been using that EHRC guidance in (fruitless) discussions with my local leisure centre. It specifically states:
A trans person who does not have a Gender Recognition Certificate retains the sex recorded on their birth certificate for the purposes of the Act.

Ermine's work collated:
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/list/successful?commit=Search&page=1&query=Ermine+Amies&request_date_after=&request_date_before=

Thanks for this link - I think I’ll need to add it to the list of instructions in future because where people weren’t able to find policies on the websites, Ermine’s research often provided policy docs, or at least revealing comments. Worth a look even if policies do turn up on the website for a compare and contrast

Holy catfish, that is a serious body of work. @SeaStoat, many hats off to you. And many thanks!

Woah
2-3 weeks and you can get hormones!

sorry for some reason it quoted the wrong post - was supposed to be GenderGP

Morning @KnottyAuty North East London is part done and I should finish today. Yes I will pick up Kings College Hospital Trust

I can do one today if any outstanding

Thank you!
I think the last free one might be
Whittington Health NHS Trust

I’ve been wrestling with how to tell the London story.

It’s still the same “we’re ordinary people and we can’t tell what’s happening” as Scotland but am I right in saying:

a) the websites have a page on same or single sex accommodation - usually a page of info about this detailing what people should expect/apologies etc - but then (sometimes but not always?) a brief one-liner at the bottom about gender self ID?

b) policies not usually on the websites but available through Ermine’s FOI searches?

i) single sex policy - lots of blurb about definitions and monitoring etc then an Appendix at the end regarding trans self ID - but it’s not referenced anywhere other than the index?

ii) transgender policy - usual self ID with an EqIA which refers to gender and misses sex off the EA list entirely?

Any other big features I’m missing?

Which trust was most egregious? And why?

London North West was particularly sneaky I thought but I’m yet to read them all….

thanks so much for all your excellent ferreting!
😍😊🥰🤩🙏🏻💐

@KnottyAuty, my main take from what everyone has been saying on here is that while most London trusts seem to have clear statements that they provide single sex spaces (from toilets to mental health support groups), they also all have statements that trans people are allowed to use whatever space they want (and should never be prevented from doing so). Which means that in fact, most London trusts are mixed sex by stealth.

They also mostly seem to be basing their policies on a single (very outdated and in the case of the “providing services” document, withdrawn) set of documents.

I think for the ones I've seen it's the total disconnect between saying they offer single-sex wards etc but gender people can go where they like and there being no acknowledgement about the conflict here. That it makes their single-sex policies meaningless and they're lying to patients - and children are included in this. The few EqIAS i saw only referenced trans people, never any mention of women/children. Sometimes PC of 'sex' replaced with 'gender'. Also found references to docs i couldn't find - don't know if they never existed or if they had been removed or only accessible if internal to the Trust.