Sadiq Khan has no idea what grooming gangs are.

[NoNever]

Sadiq Khan either really doesn’t know which makes him incompetent or is pretending not to know which makes him complicit.

https://x.com/sammywoodhouse1/status/1879943683082186847

Yes, and that is the point, really isn't it. He could even have said himself, "do you mean gangs primarily consisting of Pakistani men?

And this is why the first round of enquiries did not do much to address the issue...because in avoiding facing that there was a particular pattern of grooming - it could never be dealt with at root.

“You can bet there would have been no such "concern that the ethnic element could damage community cohesion" if those men had been targeting people with higher social 'value'. Those working class girls were seen as worthless. That was the problem. That was the loophole exploited by those despicable men.”

Absolutely, great point. @Flustration
The common factor amongst the victims of grooming gangs are that they are working class, vulnerable girls - girls in care, girls from homes with DV, girls living in poverty.

The reason a blind eye was turned wasn’t due to the ethnicity of a handful of perpetrators, but due to the low status of the girls and our own misogynistic culture.

While this blind eye was being turned to the rape of these working class girls, MPs were having their me too moment combatting sexual harassment in Parliament. Yes upper class women in the top 1% of society being propositioned, leered at, wolf whistled and lacy pants put in their offices as a prank was FAR more important to stamp out than protecting poor, vulnerable working class girls from being gang raped every night for years.

Ofc, I care about both, but there is a clear class divide in this country as to which females are worthy of respect and protection and which are not. The prioritisation isn’t based on need, but social status. That is a British culture thing.

The demonisation of one ethnicity as more likely to be a perpetrator is a racist myth so we can deflect the focus from our own culture’s misogyny and how it amplifies down the class pyramid.

How many women are doing this?

They are in a position to say there is NO evidence for the myth British Pakistani men are more likely to be perpetrators.

You have NO evidence of this “common pattern” you elide to.

Your post illustrates why the first round of enquiries was ineffective and why such gangs are still operating.

Child abuse and grooming comes in many forms, each with their own particular pattern. The problem with the last enquiry was that it treated all child abuse as a job lot...and didn't address the specific patterns that were common across numerous towns in Britain...and that was that these gangs were comprised of Asian, primarily Pakistani men...operating in family groupings ( fathers, brothers, uncles, cousins) and from local Asian take-aways and taxi services.

How many women are doing this?

It's not "the only common feature" not that it's not a common feature. Don't be disingenuous.

Child abuse and grooming comes in many forms, each with their own particular pattern. The problem with the last enquiry was that it treated all child abuse as a job lot...and didn't address the specific patterns that were common across numerous towns in Britain...and that was that these gangs were comprised of Asian, primarily Pakistani men...operating in family groupings ( fathers, brothers, uncles, cousins) and from local Asian take-aways and taxi services.

This.

He knew full well the specific issue being addressed was Asian/Pakistani grooming gangs.....but because his priority was to suggest racism rather than address the issue, he managed to play on her desire not to be seen as racist.

This was the issue with the first round of enquiries and why there now needs to be another set of enquiries.

They are in a position to say there is NO evidence for the myth British Pakistani men are more likely to be perpetrators.

I don't say that they are "more likely"? Nice straw man. By you and the government.

And there is plenty of evidence that there have been grooming gangs across the country which have raped and brutally conditioned female children into sex with older men. There is plenty of evidence that the race issue has caused problems in tackling them effectively. Read the Rotherham report, or Maggie Oliver's work, if you're interested. Which I don't believe you actually are.

Fully agree @Shortshriftandlethal

It was not just in Rotherham though, was it...it was across numerous towns and cities and the profile of the offenders was broadly similar - and that was Asian, primarily Pakistani, men. Blackpool, Oldham, Rochdale, Bradford, Keighley....

Yes, and that is the point, really isn't it. He could even have said himself, "do you mean gangs primarily consisting of Pakistani men?

And this is why the first round of enquiries did not do much to address the issue...because in avoiding facing that there was a particular pattern of grooming - it could never be dealt with at root.

💯

That is not the issue..the issue in this instance is specific types of grooming gangs in numerous towns and cities. This is a fact. A specific kind of fact, which led to a very specific kind and pattern of abuse.

She is a joke she knows what she’s doing. She doesn’t give a fuck about the girls. She just wants her nasty racist ideas to be perpetuated and well done Sadiq Khan for not allowing that.

There is nothing "nasty" about pointing out patterns that are common to different types of abuse. Sadiq Khan's response emphasised the race issue even more - by trying to shame people into not naming the truth of it. And that is also why the issue has now resurfaced, and why there will now be even more talk about Asian grooming gangs - because first time around it was not addressed adequately.

Certain Pakistani communities, in large proportion, are originating from a very particular region of Pakistan ( rural, uneducated regions..not middle class city dwellers from Peshawar, Lahore etc) and this is reflected in other current issues such as honour based codes and violence towards women and girls, and the issue of cousin marriage. ( which was looked at on Woman's Hour, today)

I didn't say it wasn't?

My argument was that men use their social power to benefit from good old fashioned British misogyny and class bias.

In the case of Rotherham and the examples you've listed it was the toxic meeting of British Pakistani misogyny and traditional British social class-based misogyny.

Name it. But name ALL of it.

Yes, though, of course, most of the perpetrators were also working class. They tended not to be from educated Pakistani families originating in the big cities such as Peshawar or Lahore, but from rural, farming regions in very specific areas.

i’m guessing that Khan wanted Susan Hall to actually name her nasty views by referring to Pakistani gangs but she wouldn’t. just look up police statistics of crimes against children 85% of white men. It doesn’t make it any better for the child or worse for the child this twisting of what happened it’s just a political stunt. It’s nothing to do with children.

The issue is children. White working class girls in care matter too. The issue at hand is predominantly Asian, predominantly Pakistani, grooming gangs in numerous towns and cities with large Pakistani populations such as Rotherham, Rochdale, Bradford, Telford...and the reasons why these specific types and patterns of child abuse are still happening is because people don't want to face that there are ethnic and cultural issues at play, for fear of being labelled as 'racist'.

He was goady

No excuses for that kind of stunt

I have no doubt some are using this to push a racist agenda, but (once again for the hard of thinking) they are only able to do this because the police and social services failed to do their jobs and ignored what was happening.

Yes, but working class men often have social capital. The girls had none.

As far as I understand it many of the men were related and many were small business owners and employers.

They did not need to have great amounts of social capital, just more than the girls they victimised.

Had they been recruiting girls from mostly well-connected middle class families they would have encountered more resistance, because middle class girls from families with higher social status trump concerns over "social cohesion".

Though, of course, it was only white girls they targeted in this way - so there is an element of race in it too. I imagine Pakistani/Muslim girs are viewed in a different way...and the abuse, if there is any, will be in the context of the home or the specific ethnic community. Honour based codes, forced marriage and so on.

• As of March 2024, 5% of children in care in England were Asian. This is much lower than the proportion of Asian children in the general population.

• White children are more likely to be in care than Asian children. For example, in 2021, White children made up 80.3% of care cases, while Asian children made up 4%.
• Black and Mixed or multiple ethnicities are also over-represented in the care system compared to the general population.

This may well suggest that abuse in Asian families is more hidden than in white or black/mixed race families.

If the truth had been acknowledged and the issues confronted and dealt with at the time, instead of this extended cover up, mass gaslighting of the public and silencing of whistle blowers, we wouldn't be in this mess now.
Thousands of children were groomed, raped, tortured, drugged and trafficked. Nothing was done because of fears of accusations of racism and because senior people in in local and national government, the police, social services, religious communities were all involved and complicit.
It is utterly shameful that this has been allowed to go on for so long and is continuing to go on.
There should be NO sacred castes.