Girl with suspected autism faces 12-match ban for asking transgender opponent: ‘Are you a man?’

[rooshoe]

m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/teenage-girl-17-with-suspected-autism-faces-12-match-ban-for-asking-transgender-opponent-are-you-a-man/a1896883124.html

It's in the Telegraph too but that's behind a paywall - has anyone covered this on here already?

I have girls (the female kind) who play this and other 'boy' sports. I'm so worried. To even question the situation could mean severe punishment. What is wrong with this world?!

Another way of putting this is to say that people with autism are not very good at lying. (Was the boy in the Emperor's new clothes story autistic, I wonder?)

What all this trans madness comes down to is that we are all being required to lie. And if we refuse, then they have ways of forcing us to comply.

But some people just won't cave in. Whether that's because we have autism or because we have a strong ethical code against lying, it doesn't matter. You can't force everyone to be liars.

@ImustLearn2Cook I feel exactly the same about the world my daughter is growing up in. When I was growing up in the 80s, I felt so optimistic about the future for women. We must make sure our daughters learn to stand their ground. I have had a couple of fallings out with dd (16) about the trans issue. I think that's because she cares very much about being kind and it's never directly impacted her.

The FA have refused to implement the guidance issued by the council of sport for England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Island, in September 2021 which states that gender identify should not be used to opt into sex affected sports. There is clear evidence that football is a sex affected sport.

FIFA have also failed to ensure the protection of the female category, in fact there are several male players taking the highest salaries and accolades on the global stage in the female competition and are likely to have played a significant part in how the womens' football competition played out in the Olympics.

There is a goalie, who played for the Womens' football team representing British Universities while being significantly older than most of the other players and being funded to "disprove in my research is that trans women have an advantage and that you’re taking a place away from a girl". Any team with a male body in goal against female bodies, has a significant advantage over the opposition.

We can play mixed sports - but many women and girls, want the opportunity to play womens' sports - for many reasons - not least that the wealth of evidence that we have, shows that women will not be equally represented, have equal opportunities to win and are at physical risk when they go head to head with men.

The article clearly states that player in question believed it to be a womens football match.

Again - I wonder - why on earth FIFA and the FA are so influenced by a small group and why they cannot listen to women.

There are actually no common autistic traits, because autism is unique for every person who has it.

I am autistic. I have no problem recognising gender.

What that actually means is that I can clearly see that a man is not a woman, just because he says he is. I think that most people can see that, but they pretend that they can’t.

Exactly. Is there any other similar fact we have legislated against in this way?

Or it’s like asking a child to write a statement explaining why they dared to say the sky is blue. And using coercion so they say otherwise

I cannot comprehend how we’ve got here. It’s undone simply by a child who finds it hard to lie

It’s just sexism and misogyny. To the FA, women aren’t worth the PR issues and personal reputation risk of taking on the TRAs.

There are actually no common autistic traits, because autism is unique for every person who has it.

I can't see how that follows – a broken leg is slightly different for everyone who has it, but there are still things they all have in common and key identifying features.

If there are literally no common autistic traits, how it it diagnosed and what is it? Last time I looked there were several core traits which are required for a diagnosis to be made.

MilletOver · Today 09:01

So the safeguarding officer is there to protect the feelings of the opponent rather than the physical safety of the female player?

That would be my conclusion of how the safeguarding person has decided that they should play, rather than what they are there for. I really fail to see how being slightly irritated trumps a shattered knee, or similar. It's perfectly legal to exclude trans players from women and girl's sports, various legal eagles have explained this, on numerous occasions, so why the FA and ECB etc have decided to interpret that as "Must not ever exclude," is beyond me.

Oh hang on, it's because trans activists have been extremely pushy and dishonest, in order to bully sports authorities into acquiescence, with a few notable exceptions, such as rugby.

‘There are actually no common autistic traits, because autism is unique for every person who has it.’

That is not true. It is a spectrum disorder so it has different levels of severity. But there are common traits that identify it as a particular disorder.

FWIW everyone is a unique individual including people with disabilities or disorders. However, that does not mean that certain disabilities do not have common traits. And those common traits do not take away a person’s unique personality, temperament and life experience.

There is a diagnostic criteria for diagnosed autism spectrum disorder. I have been through the entire assessment process with doctors and a paediatrician with my family member. And there are recognisable common traits of autism which form the basis of the diagnostic criteria used by doctors to diagnose autism.

Autism is not something that anyone can be diagnosed with arbitrarily. Or something trivial that anyone can claim that they are autistic without going through the assessment process.

Below is an extract I have copied and pasted from autism diagnostic criteria dsm-5.

https://www.autismspeaks.org/autism-diagnostic-criteria-dsm-5

Autism spectrum disorder DSM-5 diagnostic criteria: Full text
A. Persistent deficits in social communication and social interaction across multiple contexts, as manifested by the following, currently or by history (examples are illustrative, not exhaustive, see text):

1. Deficits in social-emotional reciprocity, ranging, for example, from abnormal social approach and failure of normal back-and-forth conversation; to reduced sharing of interests, emotions, or affect; to failure to initiate or respond to social interactions.
2. Deficits in nonverbal communicative behaviors used for social interaction, ranging, for example, from poorly integrated verbal and nonverbal communication; to abnormalities in eye contact and body language or deficits in understanding and use of gestures; to a total lack of facial expressions and nonverbal communication.
3. Deficits in developing, maintaining, and understanding relationships, ranging, for example, from difficulties adjusting behavior to suit various social contexts; to difficulties in sharing imaginative play or in making friends; to absence of interest in peers.

She's been banned for six matches!

Girl footballer with suspected autism is 'banned' after asking transgender opponent: 'Are you a man? https://mol.im/a/14049239

madness

Absolute disgrace. Surely being unable to question is a safeguarding issue?

Awful. But that's the only way the FA can continue to wedge men into women's sport - by threatening and bullying women and girls into silence about the threats to their safety and inclusion.

I can't imagine the stress that poor girl must be under right now. She did nothing wrong and the fact that she is being punished for simply saying what she could bloody see in front of her rather than assuming someones internal special feelings is a fucking travesty.

I am so disgusted with the FA right now.

It's something of a reprise of Lesbian Nan, isn't it? Surely her question was protected free speech? I hope she looks into legal action.

Time for @Stefanodad to eat half that hat maybe.

Poor girl, I can't see how she did anything wrong and the process of sitting in front of a panel sounds terrifying.

I tried to find out who these people are that sit on the National Serious Case Panel and only found one woman. She stepped down in October after almost 7 years. Coincidence?

Is there anyway a court case could be taken against the FA. I mean this is endangering women players.

I hope she is able to get legal help. I'd like to know if this would have happened if she'd asked a non-trans-identifying man if he was a man, and if she'd asked a woman if she was a man (both are perfectly possible, especially with ASD). Because as far as I can see unless she would have been trialled and banned in the exact same way, this is discrimination on the grounds of gender reassignment, or just basically unreasonable and challengeable.

I'd say that there's an arguable case based on Art 10 of the Human Rights Act and freedom of expression. The right can only be interfered with if the interference is a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim. Proportionality would be partly about balancing the consequences for the girl against the consequences for the transgender player. A twelve-match ban seems likely to be ruled disproportionate.

Edited to add: on re-reading the girl has been "charged" through the internal disciplinary process, but I don't think a conclusion has been reached? I'd be fairly sure that the FA would be following legal advice as to the right way to conduct the hearing, and the legal options available. (And as someone else pointed out, it is a Telegraph story which is partly written to work Telegraph readers up into a rage.)

These by @ImustLearn2Cook are very good points:

By punishing her and accusing her of repeated transphobia and not in anyway taking her suspected autism into account, constitutes disability discrimination

Why is a perceived discrimination against a trans woman very wrong but somehow justifies discrimination against someone else’s disability

Policing people’s words does not work because not everyone is able to communicate in the same way or the “correct way"

This is also reported in the Telegraph, including that the panel kept calling the alleged victim “he”, (which would rather flag up the reasonableness of the girl in asking if the “victim”/crybully was a man) and that “The FA decided against publishing written reasons for the case.” - you don’t say!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/06/girl-with-autism-banned-transgender-opponent-man/

Utter utter madness

Thank you! Paywall-free link to Telegraph article
https://archive.ph/t7DzN

FFS

Some people - most people - use pronouns to mean sex. Some people use pronouns to mean gender identity. Some of the second group doubtless have to undertake internal mental gymnastics in order to do so.

As ever, what goes punished is the lack of allegiance to the special belief system. Despite the fact that, logically, more offense ought to be taken when gender identity believers use the undesired pronouns.