Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Newson Health and the menopause industry

386 replies

ArabellaScott · 30/09/2024 07:34

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp8e5y4e83lo

Keeping an eye on this. Newson makes an awful lot of money out of HRT.

Dr Louise Newson looking at the camera - she has a jaw-length bob with a long fringe, which is a red/gold colour. She is wearing a patterned silk blouse and is wearing pink lipstick. She is wearing earphones as the shot was taken from a Zoom call. Behi...

Louise Newson: TV menopause doctor concerns probed by watchdog

Doctors and patients question the prescribing of high HRT doses by Dr Louise Newson and her clinics.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp8e5y4e83lo

OP posts:
Thread gallery
23
Angrymum22 · 06/10/2024 08:26

WarriorN · 06/10/2024 06:51

It's not just that, it's all the health benefits – helping to reduce heart disease, osteoporosis, diabetes and dementia because it reduces inflammation.

Even I can now see that that is such a simplistic framing of a really complex area.

All those things are very separate conditions. And there is more or as much evidence for lifestyle factors (depending on which condition you're looking at.)

Exercise in particular is extremely anti inflammatory. That's why cancer and heart op patients are encouraged to do so. It is definitely much harder to exercise on the same way as you did when you're younger. And the more deconditioned you are, the more you need to build up very slowly. But that is the same for men and women generally

Women also need to follow very different guidelines for exercise to men, based on their physiology. For example women must eat within 30/40 mins after a proper workout/ heavy lifting, as well as a small amount before. If you're actively exercising, intermittent fasting is not helpful. "Time restriction" is fine - which is just normal eating, have a break over night for 12-13 hrs. Women also need a decent breakfast. I found Stacy sim's advice extremely helpful on all this. And feel I could have done with knowing about it all a decade ago as peri started.

I've had to hide and unfollow some social media people/ groups because the shouting about hrt being "the only thing to work" is really distressing (as I believed that thanks to LN) and I now know is BS. She was right to re start the conversation and campaign for women to access via the nhs. But that's very different to some of the claims she makes.

You are correct. From a medical perspective the menopause is just one of many factors that may have a minor roll in the process of aging.
But with the current trend HRT is seen as a cure all. The reason LN is coming under fire is that she is prescribing higher and higher doses to treat these symptoms when they don’t respond to the advised doses. There comes a point when there is a bit of a cross over.
If you google symptoms of low oestrogen and compare them with symptoms of too much oestrogen the list is pretty similar.
HRT is still in its infancy and LN is making the school boy error of increasing doses when there is poor response. Since many of the symptoms of menopause have a huge differential component, blinkered focus on menopause is poor medicine.
Before embarking on HRT a robust evaluation of all the symptoms should be undertaken to rule out more serious conditions.
In addition, the possible side effects of HRT should be addressed. I had no idea that HRT would fuel the growth of fibroids, which usually shrink post menopause when they are no longer fuelled by hormones. I suffered from debilitating sciatica as a result of multiple large fibroids causing pressure on nerves in my lower abdomen. Just one possible outcome.
Also that breast cancer is not the only cancer risk that is slightly increased. We talk in terms of statistics, the reality of being one of the unlucky percentage is very different. LN reassures women with risk assessment but those numbers are real people and you can be one of them. Something that I didn’t fully appreciate until I was diagnosed out of the blue. It’s very easy to be flippant but time and again on the support sites I use new members arrive with the same question, “why me?” having done everything right, diet, exercise etc. they are angry and confused that it has happened to them. We know that it is generally bad luck but so many of them are also asking the question “ is it my HRT?”.

There is currently no reporting system if you are diagnosed with bc while taking HRT, the data is derived from trials and studies which may be flawed simply because candidates for the trials are often heavily screen and not necessarily an example of the general population. For example anyone with a history of bc in the family may be excluded.

I took HRT for four years before being diagnosed with bc. Even with hindsight I would still have taken it because it was the best choice for me. However, I may not have taken it for as long. Evidence suggests that the longer you take it for the greater your risk of bc. This is something not addressed by LN, she uses the overall risk.
Taking HRT for 12 mnths does not increase the risk however after 10yrs your risk is significantly higher than at 5yrs. The risk is accumulative. This is often a difficult concept for people to understand so is simplified to overall risk.

I had radiotherapy which caries a risk of causing leukaemia. The risk is longterm so I may develop it in 20yrs or so. I’m 60 so for me , developing another form of cancer in my 80s is an acceptable risk. I may have looked at it differently if I had been 40 at diagnosis.

I was 53 when I started HRT, I’m sort of glad I didn’t start HRT any earlier.

Risk assessment is a personal process, it’s complicated. Maybe we should simplify it with some kind of formula that gives you a number so you can visualise your personal risk. It certainly helps post cancer treatment, to put a figure on your risk of the cancer returning. But there is so much more data available on relative outcomes with bc treatment. HRT is still a bit of an unknown.

Whyherewego · 06/10/2024 08:53

Angrymum22 · 06/10/2024 08:26

You are correct. From a medical perspective the menopause is just one of many factors that may have a minor roll in the process of aging.
But with the current trend HRT is seen as a cure all. The reason LN is coming under fire is that she is prescribing higher and higher doses to treat these symptoms when they don’t respond to the advised doses. There comes a point when there is a bit of a cross over.
If you google symptoms of low oestrogen and compare them with symptoms of too much oestrogen the list is pretty similar.
HRT is still in its infancy and LN is making the school boy error of increasing doses when there is poor response. Since many of the symptoms of menopause have a huge differential component, blinkered focus on menopause is poor medicine.
Before embarking on HRT a robust evaluation of all the symptoms should be undertaken to rule out more serious conditions.
In addition, the possible side effects of HRT should be addressed. I had no idea that HRT would fuel the growth of fibroids, which usually shrink post menopause when they are no longer fuelled by hormones. I suffered from debilitating sciatica as a result of multiple large fibroids causing pressure on nerves in my lower abdomen. Just one possible outcome.
Also that breast cancer is not the only cancer risk that is slightly increased. We talk in terms of statistics, the reality of being one of the unlucky percentage is very different. LN reassures women with risk assessment but those numbers are real people and you can be one of them. Something that I didn’t fully appreciate until I was diagnosed out of the blue. It’s very easy to be flippant but time and again on the support sites I use new members arrive with the same question, “why me?” having done everything right, diet, exercise etc. they are angry and confused that it has happened to them. We know that it is generally bad luck but so many of them are also asking the question “ is it my HRT?”.

There is currently no reporting system if you are diagnosed with bc while taking HRT, the data is derived from trials and studies which may be flawed simply because candidates for the trials are often heavily screen and not necessarily an example of the general population. For example anyone with a history of bc in the family may be excluded.

I took HRT for four years before being diagnosed with bc. Even with hindsight I would still have taken it because it was the best choice for me. However, I may not have taken it for as long. Evidence suggests that the longer you take it for the greater your risk of bc. This is something not addressed by LN, she uses the overall risk.
Taking HRT for 12 mnths does not increase the risk however after 10yrs your risk is significantly higher than at 5yrs. The risk is accumulative. This is often a difficult concept for people to understand so is simplified to overall risk.

I had radiotherapy which caries a risk of causing leukaemia. The risk is longterm so I may develop it in 20yrs or so. I’m 60 so for me , developing another form of cancer in my 80s is an acceptable risk. I may have looked at it differently if I had been 40 at diagnosis.

I was 53 when I started HRT, I’m sort of glad I didn’t start HRT any earlier.

Risk assessment is a personal process, it’s complicated. Maybe we should simplify it with some kind of formula that gives you a number so you can visualise your personal risk. It certainly helps post cancer treatment, to put a figure on your risk of the cancer returning. But there is so much more data available on relative outcomes with bc treatment. HRT is still a bit of an unknown.

Thank you for this post, it hits the nail on the head on each woman having to really balance her own approach. Personalised medicine as it were. We all have different histories, risk appetites and aspirations and fears for the future. There is no one size fits all. The problem is that nhs GP doesn't have time for this in depth conversation for the most part, when you go private be that LN or others, they should be able to spend more time explaining all this. I feel informed but aware that research is evolving and so my information is only as good as what we know now and that may change.

SummerScarf · 06/10/2024 08:58

I’m worried about my risks (BMI 28, mother had breast cancer at 70) but I take it because it was that or be unable to work in the career I love and had just reached my goal level at. In fact without it I’d be so fatigued and unwell I doubt I could work at all and I’m single with no family support so... I’m trying to work on my weight, but it’s hard when (despite the HRT) I generally feel too fatigued to exercise. Before perimenopause I was a fit gym bunny with a BMI of 23. So it’s worth it for me. But I do worry, and I’m certainly not going to start taking experimental high doses.

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 06/10/2024 09:59

SummerScarf · 06/10/2024 08:58

I’m worried about my risks (BMI 28, mother had breast cancer at 70) but I take it because it was that or be unable to work in the career I love and had just reached my goal level at. In fact without it I’d be so fatigued and unwell I doubt I could work at all and I’m single with no family support so... I’m trying to work on my weight, but it’s hard when (despite the HRT) I generally feel too fatigued to exercise. Before perimenopause I was a fit gym bunny with a BMI of 23. So it’s worth it for me. But I do worry, and I’m certainly not going to start taking experimental high doses.

I don't want to derail the thread, but have you spoken to a doctor about your concernn about genetic isk of bc? They can advise and offer genetic testing/mammograms if necessary. As your mum was 70 though it's probably unnecessary (I'm not a Dr though! )

SummerScarf · 06/10/2024 11:00

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 06/10/2024 09:59

I don't want to derail the thread, but have you spoken to a doctor about your concernn about genetic isk of bc? They can advise and offer genetic testing/mammograms if necessary. As your mum was 70 though it's probably unnecessary (I'm not a Dr though! )

Thanks. Yes sorry for the merail, but that’s exactly what the doctors have said. They’re not worried about me being on HRT until I’m considerably older than I am now.

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 06/10/2024 11:23

SummerScarf · 06/10/2024 11:00

Thanks. Yes sorry for the merail, but that’s exactly what the doctors have said. They’re not worried about me being on HRT until I’m considerably older than I am now.

Hopefully that's reassuring 💐

I have a slight familial increased risk of bc so I understand your concerns.

Weighing up all these factors is so tricky, and so individual.

Angrymum22 · 06/10/2024 11:30

SummerScarf · 06/10/2024 08:58

I’m worried about my risks (BMI 28, mother had breast cancer at 70) but I take it because it was that or be unable to work in the career I love and had just reached my goal level at. In fact without it I’d be so fatigued and unwell I doubt I could work at all and I’m single with no family support so... I’m trying to work on my weight, but it’s hard when (despite the HRT) I generally feel too fatigued to exercise. Before perimenopause I was a fit gym bunny with a BMI of 23. So it’s worth it for me. But I do worry, and I’m certainly not going to start taking experimental high doses.

Have you addressed the fatigue with your GP. Menopause is not the only cause of fatigue. This is what I’m referring to in my post that yet again ( we saw it in the 80s when HRT became popular) every symptom women suffer during there 40s and 50s is blamed on peri menopause when there are plenty of other real diseases that can cause symptoms.
B12, iron and magnesium deficiency can cause all manner of problems. They are a byproduct of perimenopause due to increasing heavy periods and resulting blood loss. But often only the hormones are address.
I felt fantastic during perimenopause because I had a Mirena coil fitted which stopped my periods ( endometriosis) and prevented the chronic anaemia that had blighted my 30s. Mirena is known to help women cope with peri, so much so that I was unaware of any symptoms until I hit menopause proper.

I do wonder how much fear and anxiety is involved with the massive drive to get every woman onto HRT. We have successfully created a big market for the drug companies overnight based on fear of menopause. The media campaign is totally biased. No one has bothered to canvass the experience of the large number of women who have moved through menopause without problems.

I think we need a more balanced presentation. I’m told that LN is evangelical about HRT because of her own lived experience which she is still struggling with. As clinicians it is important to be completely objective, assuming that every woman is suffering from the same menopause as yourself is dangerous. This often translates as a GP who doesn’t always appear sympathetic. I would rather a GP looks for differential diagnosis than prescribes HRT after a quick 10 min consult because you tick the boxes.

I recently had some concerns about my chronic endocrine condition. My GP was great, he read through my notes prior to the appointment, did a full examination and agreed that we needed to rule out a particular cause before looking for others causes. So he did an extensive blood panel and wrote to my consultant. Within 3 weeks I had completed the investigations and spoken to my consultant. He could have simply put it down to my meds or a recent car accident where I had suffered whiplash, but he took the time to approach it holistically.

I would say that most GPs would do the same but if a patient has an agenda then it is all too easy to be railroaded into prescribing HRT without considering more serious causes of the presenting symptoms. It is all too easy to go in with a check list.

You only have to look at how easy it is to get the weight loss injections, another dodgy area of pharma waiting to cause the NHS problems, to realise that a list of symptoms and a fake BMI can line the pockets of both the online pharmacy and the doctors they use to assess suitability. The appalling thing is that these drugs are globally in short supply and possibly affecting the health of those who genuinely need them to control diabetes.

SummerScarf · 06/10/2024 11:39

Thanks, and yes, sorry for the derailing into my own health. Without going into detail, I’ve had all sorts of investigations for the fatigue and indeed have been successfully treated for one cause of it, but I’m sure the remainder is down to perimenopause and I have plenty of other symptoms (notably debilitating hot flushes and night sweats) which the HRT is keeping in check. It does seem that fatigue is both one of the commonest and the most difficult to treat symptoms of menopause in general.

JasmineTea11 · 06/10/2024 11:47

Very patronising remark from a GP suggesting women expect to feel 21 again.
I just wanted to be able to go about my life without really painful bones, to be able to exercise and go for walks. And it worked, which I'm very grateful for.
Although I accept her assertion that its promoted a magic bullet, but that's just the pervasive desire to over simplify complicated things.

BustyCrustacean · 06/10/2024 12:20

Not read the thread but just wanted to add that, after being left in an awful emotional position after surgical meno 4 years ago, I Iooked at the Newson website for info and with a view to an appointment. I can't remember the context but something to do with "people" or "men and women" who experience meno was referenced and it made my blood run cold. Just bollocks to you, Newson et al!! I stopped reading and have zero interest in a meno specialist who fkn panders to gender ideology- so pathetic. Sorry for the derail- good to get off chest!
Also, looks like there's some question as to how beneficial HRT is and it's good to see the GP @WitheringHighs , I think, on this thread acknowledging that HRT is not the magic bullet for all. This is definitely my experience- I've had years trying different permutations of it and it's made me feel consistently miserable- but I've kept chasing that elusive feeling of well-being. No more now and glad to hear it's not just a me thing.
If there are any ladies who've had a surgical meno and are doing well without HRT, I'd love to hear about it!

Ereshkigalangcleg · 06/10/2024 13:08

Not read the thread but just wanted to add that, after being left in an awful emotional position after surgical meno 4 years ago, I Iooked at the Newson website for info and with a view to an appointment. I can't remember the context but something to do with "people" or "men and women" who experience meno was referenced and it made my blood run cold. Just bollocks to you, Newson et al!! I stopped reading and have zero interest in a meno specialist who fkn panders to gender ideology- so pathetic. Sorry for the derail- good to get off chest!

It's not just Newson, it's going to be all over the wording of the new NICE guidelines. Look at some of the consultation documents on the NICE website (Arabella posted a link below).

And GenderGP is listed as a "Diagnosis and Management Stakeholder" (in a long list) Confused

BustyCrustacean · 06/10/2024 14:12

thanks for that @Ereshkigalangcleg albeit terrifying!
I knew the NHS had been captured but thought it was extricating itself from all this gender shit- very disturbing that it continues to add it in.
I suppose with Newson, I saw her as a bit of an independent champion of menopausal women so it really enraged me to see her parroting gender shite

Angrymum22 · 06/10/2024 14:49

Regarding transgender HRT, I have a patient who is transgender. She has to limit the dose of oestrogen because her mum has had breast cancer. She has been advised that the hormones increase her risk of breast cancer. I find it odd that a genetic man is strongly advised but gloves are off for women.
I know that the science is probably different but equally there seems to be far more caution.

Angrymum22 · 06/10/2024 14:54

BustyCrustacean · 06/10/2024 14:12

thanks for that @Ereshkigalangcleg albeit terrifying!
I knew the NHS had been captured but thought it was extricating itself from all this gender shit- very disturbing that it continues to add it in.
I suppose with Newson, I saw her as a bit of an independent champion of menopausal women so it really enraged me to see her parroting gender shite

She is in it for the financial gain. Her prices are off the scale compared to other private consultation services. I work in private practice and it worries me how much value she places on her time. We actually have better clinical services from gyno/endo specialists who charge about the same. Much more one stop though, they will look at all aspects of gyni health in relationship to menopause. I know who I would choose.

LN ‘s overheads in no way compare to the specialists I refer to. Her clinics are pretty much consultation rooms and a reception. Bloods are outsourced. She may have an examination bed and overhead lamp but since she has no gyni qualifications there is no need for expensive equipment.

As someone who has set up dental surgeries the cost is eye watering. Just the dental chair alone is £15+. I think the current cost of a new surgery is upwards of £50k. A consultation room will consist of a few chairs, a desk and examination couch. Probably the most expensive bit of equipment is the coffee machine in the waiting area.

Angrymum22 · 06/10/2024 15:04

Sorry, in addition LN does a lot of follow up consults over the phone which are charged at almost the same cost. The doctor may well conduct them from home. I know that our local GP practice do.
It’s a very lucrative business, take a look at her accounts.

ncncncncncnchhh · 06/10/2024 15:07

The NHS has run out of money to prescribe HRT so it's easier for the establishment to discredit whoever can be discredited. Like it or not Louise Newson is popularising HRT which makes more people want to take it. I personally don't care - if you want to pay for it, go for it. I can't take it myself due to a rare estrogen sensitive condition that is controlled by another medication. HRT won't work for everyone and it would be good to try all the basic boring things first but sometimes you need a little help. However every medication has a side effect. Your choice at the end of the day. The issue like with everything is where the funding is coming from.

ArabellaScott · 06/10/2024 16:14

Ereshkigalangcleg · 06/10/2024 13:08

Not read the thread but just wanted to add that, after being left in an awful emotional position after surgical meno 4 years ago, I Iooked at the Newson website for info and with a view to an appointment. I can't remember the context but something to do with "people" or "men and women" who experience meno was referenced and it made my blood run cold. Just bollocks to you, Newson et al!! I stopped reading and have zero interest in a meno specialist who fkn panders to gender ideology- so pathetic. Sorry for the derail- good to get off chest!

It's not just Newson, it's going to be all over the wording of the new NICE guidelines. Look at some of the consultation documents on the NICE website (Arabella posted a link below).

And GenderGP is listed as a "Diagnosis and Management Stakeholder" (in a long list) Confused

Bloody hell!

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 06/10/2024 16:17

Angrymum22 · 06/10/2024 15:04

Sorry, in addition LN does a lot of follow up consults over the phone which are charged at almost the same cost. The doctor may well conduct them from home. I know that our local GP practice do.
It’s a very lucrative business, take a look at her accounts.

Newson is director of five active limited companies. At least, I assume she's director of the last one and that 'doctor' is a typo.

https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/officers/3oVCLnqICQAm7bzWSB5M5AhT5aE/appointments

NEWSON HEALTH GROUP LIMITED (14350059)

Director
NEWSON HEALTH (MANCHESTER) LIMITED (12497352)

Dissolved

NEWSON HEALTH HOLDINGS LIMITED (12495537)

Director
NEWSON HEALTH RESEARCH & EDUCATION LIMITED (12098873)

Director
NEWSON HEALTH LIMITED (11106782)

Director
LOUISE NEWSON MEDICAL WRITER LTD (09636761)

Doctor

Louise Rachel ANDERSON personal appointments - Find and update company information - GOV.UK

Free company information from Companies House including registered office address, filing history, accounts, annual return, officers, charges, business activity

https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/officers/3oVCLnqICQAm7bzWSB5M5AhT5aE/appointments

OP posts:
KnottedTwine · 06/10/2024 16:23

ncncncncncnchhh · 06/10/2024 15:07

The NHS has run out of money to prescribe HRT so it's easier for the establishment to discredit whoever can be discredited. Like it or not Louise Newson is popularising HRT which makes more people want to take it. I personally don't care - if you want to pay for it, go for it. I can't take it myself due to a rare estrogen sensitive condition that is controlled by another medication. HRT won't work for everyone and it would be good to try all the basic boring things first but sometimes you need a little help. However every medication has a side effect. Your choice at the end of the day. The issue like with everything is where the funding is coming from.

This is clearly nonsense, HRT is not an expensive medicine in the grand scheme of things.

I do agree though that many NHS doctors, both in general practice and in specialisms, don't like that their service is being shown up as so shit that women have no option but to pay £££ to a private clinic just to find someone to listen to them and not fob them off with positive thinking, a bit of yoga, and folic fucking acid.

ArabellaScott · 06/10/2024 16:30

Newson Health Ltd made 7.5 million profit in 2023.

I tried to download another one but the service/site was down.

OP posts:
KnottedTwine · 06/10/2024 16:42

ArabellaScott · 06/10/2024 16:30

Newson Health Ltd made 7.5 million profit in 2023.

I tried to download another one but the service/site was down.

Edited

Filling the gap which most women have found with their own GP. Look, nobody's saying that this particularl clinic is 100% squeaky clean and it is clear that some women are very unhappy with their treatment. What is also very clear to many many of us who have had the misfortune to try to deal with the NHS about menopause/HRT is that there is a desperate need for this sort of service and if you're not getting it on the NHS what are you supposed to do.

ArabellaScott · 06/10/2024 16:50

Women deserve good, supportive, helpful and evidence based treatment. Yes, this should be available on the NHS, absolutely.

One could also say that the existence of LN's private clinics not only makes her lots of money, it provides a useful way for the NHS to abdicate responsibility.

Private care/clinics are fine so long as they are also giving sound, evidence based care. Nobody should be getting fobbed off or sold a 'cure all' or getting doses raised without discussion of the potential risks.

OP posts:
Whyherewego · 06/10/2024 17:40

There's also private clinics that do all sorts of other things. And make a peetty penny out of us. I don't see us outraged at them in the same way. I had a breast reduction which should have been available on the NHS (I qualified per their criteria) but could I get someone to refer me? Nope. So I saved my money for years and then dropped best part of 10k on the best surgeon I could find. Yes I paid top dollar because the clinic was in Harley St and I got lots of care and follow up appointments and I bet that clinic made a bundle. So does LN and her ilk. It frustrates me immensely that the NHS is so broken but I can afford to sort myself out so I do. It's depressing but that's the state it is

Azaleah · 06/10/2024 17:42

ArabellaScott · 06/10/2024 16:50

Women deserve good, supportive, helpful and evidence based treatment. Yes, this should be available on the NHS, absolutely.

One could also say that the existence of LN's private clinics not only makes her lots of money, it provides a useful way for the NHS to abdicate responsibility.

Private care/clinics are fine so long as they are also giving sound, evidence based care. Nobody should be getting fobbed off or sold a 'cure all' or getting doses raised without discussion of the potential risks.

Patients go to private clinics, pay a lot of money for the first appointment and prescription of HRT and then most of them are unable to continue paying for follow-ups and return to their NHS GPs who usually continue to prescribe exactly the same regimen prescribed by the private clinics. I think it works both ways. As soon as the patient returns to the NHS, private clinics are also “abdicating responsibility”. What I don't understand is why an NHS GP doesn't prescribe a specific HRT regime for a patient, but apparently has no problem issuing a repeat "private" prescription. If this was happening in countries where people can sue a medical practitioner it would be tricky establishing who's "responsible" for the patient's safety.