Women's jail campaigners demand transmen offenders should be kept in female prisons *Title edited at OP's request*

[IwantToRetire]

Women's jail campaigners are demanding that the growing number of trans male offenders should be kept in female jails.

Dr Kate Coleman, of Keep Prisons Single Sex, said that the instances of women identifying as men mid-sentence is a “growing problem”.

But she believes that such prisoners should be treated as women - and that moving them to men’s prisons or a special “trans unit” would be misguided and dangerous.

“Whilst the focus, rightly in my view, has been on the risks that males who identify as transgender pose to women in prison, the challenges of adequately and appropriately meeting the needs of females who identify as transgender must be addressed.

“These needs must be met within the female estate.

“I understand that females who identify as men are difficult to manage.

“But there is no quandary about where to house her. She is female and belongs in the female estate. She must be managed in a way that is continuous with the way in which all other female prisoners are managed. Housing her in the male estate is not even a question that should be asked.

“This is for her own safety and for her own benefit as it is in the female estate that she will be able to access the services and programmes that are necessary for her to progress.”

NB Only extracts, NOT the whole article which can be read in full at https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/womens-jail-campaigners-demand-trans-33750904

So you cannot explain how humans reproduce. Depressingly, I had expected a non answer, which is a pity, because Id dearly like to hear the explanation from someone who believes in gender ovrr sex.

Im happy to go with 'gender agnostic'. Just to be a pain in the arse. 😊

I like Gender Apostate.

I used to (kinda) believe in Gender Identity (until I gave it some proper thought and realised it was a load of old guff dreamt up by quack sexologists).

I've been a feminist for more than half a century. I have never felt any need to 'self define' and I have never heard any other woman talk about needing to 'self define'. The right to have a job, an education, a bank account, yes. The right to control our fertility, yes. The right to political representation, yes. The right to support when we bear and raise children, yes. The right for equal pay for work of equal value, yes. The right not to be molested, yes. The right to make choices in many areas of our lives, yeas. The right to voices and to visibility, yes

But 'the right to self-define' - I don't even know what the words are meant to mean in that context.

I think I'm a gender apathete.

I just do not care. Please do not talk to me about your gender identity. It's boring. Talk to me about literally anything else.

What women are being denied is the right to self-define.

I wish to self-define as a female person. A member of the biological sex class which is defined by its childbearing role; a class which excludes all members of the male sex however they believe they identify.

They will not allow me to self-define as that. They will not even allow me to have a word for it.

Well, tough shit. The word for that is "woman", which is why I do not and will not ever accept that a male person can be a woman, no matter how he believes he identifies and no matter what body parts he has had chopped off or otherwise altered.

Are you sure? Today I've been feeling a bit like I have a new and exceptional gender identity that you've definitely never heard of, and I think it's potentially fascinating. I've made a flag and everything.

I strongly suspect it involves Pilates. I fucking hate Pilates.

Absolutely sure. Please do not.

Not to mention that its based on you agreeing to have a sex based duty of submission, pretense and enablement to the greater importance and value of a man's wishes.

Based on binary biological sex.

I'm with Arabella. There is no need at any time for Pilates.

Not to mention that its based on you agreeing to have a sex based duty of submission, pretense and enablement to the greater importance and value of a man's wishes.

Is that what Pilates is? I never knew.

So not the bloke who crucified Jesus!?

well, those women who hung around with Jesus were kinda uppity

Anyone who can sire a child is a risk to anyone who can bear one. That's where the gametes come in: they determine whether a person is at risk of being forced to become pregnant or poses the risk of forcing a pregnancy in someone else.

Gametes are what determine whether the crime we call rape poses a pregnancy risk to someone.

Recognising the risk of pregnancy from rape is not circular, nor is it an ideology. It is a pragmatic acknowledgement of biological reality.

This

If the entire feminist movement was determined by dedication to fighting the cause on mumsnet - then @RedToothBrush would have squashed all this nonsense ages ago!

Correct. Housing men in women’s prisons has also led to pregnant inmates.