3 questions for GC women

[ChirpyFinch]

As the title says, three questions for the women in this chat.

1. Do you think the majority of people are gender critical, and why/why not?

2. Globally, the right wing is more vocally gender critical than the left. They are also far more likely to be regressive on a range of women’s issues like abortion and anti-gay. Why do you think they agree with GCs on this one issue but disagree on so much else (if you think they do?)

3. How many trans people do you estimate there are globally?

I kind of get the argument from gender dysphoria, of feeling that deep down you are really the opposite sex

I think the problem is it only works if you have different words for someone who wishes they have a female body from the words for someone who actually does.

Otherwise the whole thing just becomes self contradictory.

Your biology isn't supposed to matter but if it actually didn't matter then why would anyone even care whether they were described as a man or a woman?

A person has an inner knowledge of their "real" sex based on inner feelings and they believe that is different to their actual sex. How do they know that their inner feelings are not the correct feelings for their actual sex? How do they identify what the proper inner feelings for the two sexes are?

You can't change sex. Born a man , always a man.
You can call yourself Ruth, wear make up and a dress and expect people to use she/ her but we all have eyes. Biological women will know instantly that you are a man. I will call you Ruth if you want me to. Will I think you have become a woman ? No of course I won't and neither will any of the trans allies who are fawning all over the " we're all girls together' nonsense. They know just as well as the rest of us that you are no more female than any other bloke. It just suits their agenda to go along with the pretence

Exactly. The whole movement depends on people being willing to lie. This is not a healthy or sustainable starting point.

Well, Amnesty were claiming until very recently that the Taliban were abusing people who ‘identified as female’, the implication being that if they all changed their pronouns everything would be fine.

This is SO offensive I can't even

Just disgraceful

I have asked why my post has been deleted. Particularly as I have concerns about why it was deleted.

Or they feel that they don't fit in and, if they decide to present as female when they are biolocally male then the world will suddenly be okay. The vast majority of people who are trans are also ND. It doesn't matter what they do to the outside body, the traits that cause them to feel that they don't fit in will remain.Thats why they detransition.

I reported it @RedToothBrush on the grounds I felt point 6 was unnecessarily confrontational

How do you know that everyone replying to you is gender critical? For example, I largely agree with gender critical views as I understand them, but I wouldn't describe myself as a feminist (though influenced by feminism) and I don't completely rule out some innate sex influence on typical male and female behaviours.

But the essence of gender critical is being critical of gender as a concept, particularly gender stereotypes. It also recognises that sex is binary and immutable. Women and men should not have to feel bound by stereotypical gender roles, and should be free to choose any role they are capable of, but should not infringe on other people's rights.

Where do you stand on Rachel Dolezal who says she has an innate internal feeling of being black when she is white?

Why?

Saying we have to say something is black when it's obviously white undermines society.

I'm sorry but should we burn Orwell's books because they challenge us to ask questions and to think critically?

It's offensive to be telling us we can not challenge and point out the parallels with 1984.

You have demonstrated one of the points on the post about transactivism being aligned with authoritarianism. Irony is dead.

@RedToothBrush if you read my posts I am as GC as the next person.

It wasn't what you said just the way you said it. Only the last bullet.

Ultimately it is very sad for these people that they're being sold such blatant lies. No one can change sex. 'Transitioning' is not the answer to complex psychological problems. We owe it to everyone to hold that line.

I came to this thread after reading a work email about maternity that in all seriousness referred to ‘pregnant women and birthing people’.

It upset me. I don’t think it’s inclusive, I think it’s dehumanising. My colleagues clearly think differently. But why on earth has this become so reified? Are there really enough trans men becoming pregnant despite all their deeply felt dysphoria, to justify such careful calling-out?

I think gender identity is most likely a bubble that will burst - a manifestation of late stage Western Internet-fed capitalism, if you like.

What was the bullet you disagreed with @Aria999?

It was the 'how many fingers am I holding up Winston'

I confess I didn't originally get the 1984 reference and it just came over rude, like an accusation of being really stupid.

From memory, I think it was 'how many fingers am I holding up Winston'.

In 2024 quoting from books will get you reported and deleted. What a time to be alive.

I think gender identity is most likely a bubble that will burst - a manifestation of late stage Western Internet-fed capitalism, if you like.

Quite. A result of a ridiculously individualistic, introspective culture that has lost touch with physical reality.

Cross post. So a poster reported because they missed the reference and misunderstood.

Why did MN delete, then?

I was having a discussion with my BIL about identifying as something you clearly aren't. I said that I was going to identify as Usain Bolt . I'm a 5'4" 59 year old white women with a very odd running gait. He laughed because, quite rightly, it's a ridiculous idea. I said to him that ,to me, the idea of a 6' man in pink lycra turning up to BILs cycling group and saying " Hi my names Sue" was equally laughable, but no one would have dared laugh and say " Yeah right, sure you are Keith'. They'd all have been falling over themselves not to notice the dodgy wig and genital bulge. I will never understand how it has got this far. I dare say people were trying to be kind to someone who was clearly troubled and didn't want to say " Well we'll call youJane/ Danielle/Cathy but you understand that we don't actually think you are a woman, don't you.Look where it's got us.

It was the 'how many fingers am I holding up Winston'

Christ on a bike. Is this real? And MNHQ acted on it. Man alive

Has anyone mentioned that a poster was banned for posting a cake recipe?

Well, Amnesty were claiming until very recently that the Taliban were abusing people who ‘identified as female’, the implication being that if they all changed their pronouns everything would be fine.

Quite. Just when you think Amnesty International couldn't sink any lower than they have - bam they do.

Banned, seriously?!