Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Wes Streeting addresses puberty blockers decision -excellent response

356 replies

Fenlandia · 14/07/2024 12:05

https://x.com/wesstreeting/status/1812435914473295927

x.com

https://x.com/wesstreeting/status/1812435914473295927

OP posts:
Thread gallery
33
Floisme · 14/07/2024 18:17

I'm very happy that Wes Streeting has made it over this 'low bar'. I've been very critical of Labour - and I'm still anxious - but, if Anneliese Dodds and Bridget Phillipson can show a similar level of intelligence and mettle then I'll be delighted to eat a huge piece of humble pie with lashings of custard.

Citrusandginger · 14/07/2024 18:18

ItsBinDayToday
A clinical trial will probably highlight the issues they know already exist is the best way. However his replies are full of people still calling him scum. They really don’t care about the long term health of these children as long as their feelings about this are affirmed.

How do you do a clinical trial without harming more children?

Exactly @Omlettes. How on earth could a trial get ethics approval?

UpThePankhurst · 14/07/2024 18:26

Floisme · 14/07/2024 18:17

I'm very happy that Wes Streeting has made it over this 'low bar'. I've been very critical of Labour - and I'm still anxious - but, if Anneliese Dodds and Bridget Phillipson can show a similar level of intelligence and mettle then I'll be delighted to eat a huge piece of humble pie with lashings of custard.

This is how I feel. Deeply, deeply cynical, but would be oh so happy to discover that I was wrong about Labour.

Imnobody4 · 14/07/2024 18:31

This is the very least we could expect - it was already in motion thanks to the Tories.

There's so much else - Dodds and conversion therapy, will Kishwer Falkner be reappointed, what hate speech laws will they sanction or will they stand firmly behind freedom of speech, will they enforce impartiality in civil service and deal with rogue EDI training without the vexed issue of single sex spaces.

I hope KS has the courage but many of his front bench aren't in agreement let alone the back bench MPs.

wowzw · 14/07/2024 18:33

BreatheAndFocus · 14/07/2024 18:09

Good news but I won’t believe it until it’s done. What I found gobsmacking was the absolutely insane hysteria on Twitter from (mainly) young people ranting on about “murder”, “blood on his hands”, “evil to ignore all the evidence they’re safe” (!), “Cass had no qualifications at all to do this”, etc etc.

Just ridiculous, melodramatic and mendacious crap.

"just ridiculous, melodramatic and mendacious crap.

Yes, all of those things and dangerous too.
Bloody dangerous. The crazy, blue tick TRA who are telling bare faced lies about Cass are happy to put activism before safeguarding

StaunchMomma · 14/07/2024 18:43

Unemotional, factual, measured......this government promised change and so far we really have it!

Tinysoxxx · 14/07/2024 18:50

Thank you Wes Streeting

MrsOvertonsWindow · 14/07/2024 18:59

SidewaysOtter · 14/07/2024 16:26

Where is the evidence for this uptick in suicides? The Reddit group keeps referencing “16 dead trans kids”.

As for the Fox Botherer, like others before him - certain GPs, charity CEOs etc - I suspect he’s found a career niche in being seen to be “speaking for trans kids”. Those who feel like victims (or feel their kids are victims) or who want to publicly display their Allyship will flock to people like that, which I should imagine is a fairly intoxicating position to find oneself in.

Problem is, once you’re in that position you don’t want to lose it let alone have to admit you’ve been wrong and potentially contributed to harm.

Fortunately we're a country where the unexpected death of a child (or serious harm happening) generates a Serious Case Review or Child Safeguarding Practice Review as they're now called.

So there will be major investigations into the deaths of all these children that the fox botherer can cite and we can all read.

I've been involved in 2 of these and they're seriously detailed reviews (quite scary to be interviewed ) and to be asked to explain your or your service's actions in relation to a child who subsequently died.

Floisme · 14/07/2024 19:00

StaunchMomma · 14/07/2024 18:43

Unemotional, factual, measured......this government promised change and so far we really have it!

Hmm, to be fair this ban was initially put in place by the Tory government, as Streeting himself is careful to acknowledge:
'The former Health Secretary issued an emergency order to extend the restriction on prescription to the private sector, which I am defending.'

I'm very pleased to see him do this but let's not get carried away.

lcakethereforeIam · 14/07/2024 19:01

Article in the Telegraph (apologies if it's already been posted there seem to be several threads)

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/07/14/trans-activists-vulnerable-young-people-risk-streeting/

https://archive.ph/8QyCr this link is literary violence

Nice picture of LWS

I hope Labour MPs (on the fence or otherwise uncaptured) are looking at the tra responses, at how unhinged they are and realising they don't want these people anywhere near them.

Hairyesterdaygonetoday · 14/07/2024 19:14

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 14/07/2024 13:26

Stopping the experimental treatment of children is but one part. There has been no word at all from Stonewall and co since this story broke and has now been confirmed by Wes himself. They could finally be cowering with their tail between their legs, or for all we know, a deal is being done to fuck women over.

This is about keeping children safe from harm in one specific area. The rest is very much an unknown. Hence the cautious welcomes.

Let's be honest, everyone wants to be wrong about Labour and women's rights. Nobody wants to be right!

Yes, this is exactly it. I’m delighted by this piece of good news. But Labour has pandered to the trans lobby and thrown women under the bus on so many other issues, that I’ll need a lot more before they get my vote back.

NitroNine · 14/07/2024 19:18

The content notes on Streeting’s thread are full of seething TRAs too: genuinely embarrassed for them at this point frankly.

fromorbit · 14/07/2024 19:26

The thread reviews are in:

J.K. Rowling
It is a mark of how febrile and often vicious the discourse around child transition has become that this humane, considered thread from
wesstreeting comes as such a relief. 🙏

Hadley Freeman
An upsetting read for anyone who has used gender ideology as a means for advancing their personal brand, or who genuinely believes a child can be born in the wrong body, or who is sacrificing children’s safety to validate their adult life choices.
A big relief to the rest of us

Sarah Phillimore
I have grown so accustomed to politicians saying and doing insane and stupid things that this is like a gentle rain on the parched desert of my political soul. Thank you Wes Streeting.

Katy Montgomerie
This is total bullshit. There is NO EVIDENCE to support a ban. NONE
The UK government over ruling the experts, putting it out of line with every other developed country, when we know for a fact it will harm children is disgusting
wesstreeting should resign. Absolute failure

Rubidium · 14/07/2024 19:45

This is interesting:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m00203bb/political-thinking-with-nick-robinson-series-1-74-the-pat-mcfadden-in-power-one

Pat McFadden is Keir Starmer’s enforcer. If you go to about 17’45” NR asks him about ‘woke’ issues, and PMcF replies:

“You should always remember who you’’re serving…if the job description is I’m just going to keep your activists happy... you lose touch with the voters when you do that... If you put country before party, then it’s a good guide not to get dragged down the road of stakeholder management and doing things on whatever issue because there’s a very loud group demanding that you do it”

Which I take to mean that they aren’t going to take a blind bit of notice of people having tantrums on Twitter.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 14/07/2024 19:51

I do hope you're right @Rubidium. To date labour have openly hitched themselves to the grim side of history with children and women coming second place to powerful men with a fetish.

It's been depressing to watch - but Wes Streeting's recent actions and words do give me hope.

WickedSerious · 14/07/2024 19:53

MrsOvertonsWindow · 14/07/2024 19:51

I do hope you're right @Rubidium. To date labour have openly hitched themselves to the grim side of history with children and women coming second place to powerful men with a fetish.

It's been depressing to watch - but Wes Streeting's recent actions and words do give me hope.

Edited

Indeed,it would be nice to think they've woken up but I'm not opening the champagne just yet.

fromorbit · 14/07/2024 19:57

Rubidium · 14/07/2024 19:45

This is interesting:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m00203bb/political-thinking-with-nick-robinson-series-1-74-the-pat-mcfadden-in-power-one

Pat McFadden is Keir Starmer’s enforcer. If you go to about 17’45” NR asks him about ‘woke’ issues, and PMcF replies:

“You should always remember who you’’re serving…if the job description is I’m just going to keep your activists happy... you lose touch with the voters when you do that... If you put country before party, then it’s a good guide not to get dragged down the road of stakeholder management and doing things on whatever issue because there’s a very loud group demanding that you do it”

Which I take to mean that they aren’t going to take a blind bit of notice of people having tantrums on Twitter.

Pat McFadden expressed support for Rosie three years ago one of the few who dared and he got attacked for it then and later. He is a powerful man and one of the few clearly willing to question nonsense when it counted. I count him as an useful ally we have in the cabinet right now who is not going to be cowed easily.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/sep/19/labour-mp-appalled-that-rosie-duffield-feels-unable-to-attend-conference

McFadden has a moral backbone. Also he knows that the SNP destroyed itself over this and Labour would be crazy to go the same way.

Labour MP ‘appalled’ that Rosie Duffield feels unable to attend conference

Pat McFadden says party must find way to debate difficult issues without resorting to abuse

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/sep/19/labour-mp-appalled-that-rosie-duffield-feels-unable-to-attend-conference

UpThePankhurst · 14/07/2024 20:07

It's very useful for them to see and experience first hand how unhinged the perceptions and behaviours really are.

However the ranting on twitter and the raging insistence that children will harm themselves is becoming a serious safeguarding issue in itself.

IwantToRetire · 14/07/2024 20:08

I'm late to this thread, so first of all some good news, and wonder what has been happening to Wes Streeting in the last few weeks, that he has felt able to almost be GC. Well not really, but able to speak publicly against the TRA narrative.

Slightly off topic but related, some one up thread talked about gender non conforming children.

This is how far we have been pushed into a "reality" that is just bananas.

Gender non conforming is what people for centuries have done. So going all the way, and some just adopting clothes, interestes, etc., that society tries to say are the "natural" behaviours, dress etc., of people based on their sex.

It is ridiculous that society has retreated so far into such a rigid notion that for a girl to have short hair, or a boy to like pink is seen as the start of moving towards transition.

Somehow, what was just a casual personal expression only a few decades ago is now not even recognised.

This space, not just for children and adults needs to be opened up again. Not in any way connected to sexuality, actual body dysmorphia, or fashion trends.

Unless this trend, life style, or whatever you want to call it, is opened up again then children wont see that it is quite possible to be an every day member of society.

The world didn't fall apart when women started wearing trouser suits, and (some) men stopped wearing ties (in western consumer societies).

We are supposed to be better educated, with acess to a far large range of information via the internet, but instead seem to have reverted to some sort of strict Victorian idea of how you fit into society.

I think there have been threads about this on FWR, but until this is seen, once again, as being not only natural but also desirable, it is all too easy for children to feel they must fit into the reactionary straightjacket of queer trans arguement.

Just felt this so strongly (again) when seeing that what seems such a sensible low key response has kicked off the usual outcry.

UpThePankhurst · 14/07/2024 20:09

The GC narrative IS the neutral middle ground. Let's protect children from experimentation and decisions they may come to regret, particularly from passionately political adults with agendas, and let's find answers that work for everyone's inclusion rather than destroy women's rights.

It's not extreme stuff in any way. I find it quite sad that it's been labelled as some political movement when it's just - can we be sane, sensible and responsible please?

SidewaysOtter · 14/07/2024 20:14

Also, Labour can’t just serve their activists any more. They’re in power and presumably would like to stay there, so they have to serve voters and that includes people of all political stripes. I suspect the TRA brigade are going to find they are something of a minority, even if their echo chamber makes them believe they’re a significant group. Just think about Hogwarts Legacy - they all decided to boycott it and thought their numbers would lead to it being a flop. It went on to be one of the best selling games…

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 14/07/2024 20:15

A post by post rebuttal. Apparently.

www.reddit.com/r/transgenderUK/s/wJqA4Z5m2q

(Although I'm sure we can all agree that some lawyers "say crazy things")

BettyFilous · 14/07/2024 20:40

Citrusandginger · 14/07/2024 18:18

ItsBinDayToday
A clinical trial will probably highlight the issues they know already exist is the best way. However his replies are full of people still calling him scum. They really don’t care about the long term health of these children as long as their feelings about this are affirmed.

How do you do a clinical trial without harming more children?

Exactly @Omlettes. How on earth could a trial get ethics approval?

Clinical trials usually have a data monitoring committee that reviews emerging results on an ongoing basis as the trial progresses. If clear evidence of benefit or harm emerges, the trial can be stopped or patients switched to the drug or intervention which has been definitively shown to be beneficial. I would assume (and hope) the data monitoring in a PB trial would be rigorous and the monitoring committee would intervene quickly if anything troubling emerges.

fromorbit · 14/07/2024 20:55

IwantToRetire · 14/07/2024 20:08

I'm late to this thread, so first of all some good news, and wonder what has been happening to Wes Streeting in the last few weeks, that he has felt able to almost be GC. Well not really, but able to speak publicly against the TRA narrative.

Slightly off topic but related, some one up thread talked about gender non conforming children.

This is how far we have been pushed into a "reality" that is just bananas.

Gender non conforming is what people for centuries have done. So going all the way, and some just adopting clothes, interestes, etc., that society tries to say are the "natural" behaviours, dress etc., of people based on their sex.

It is ridiculous that society has retreated so far into such a rigid notion that for a girl to have short hair, or a boy to like pink is seen as the start of moving towards transition.

Somehow, what was just a casual personal expression only a few decades ago is now not even recognised.

This space, not just for children and adults needs to be opened up again. Not in any way connected to sexuality, actual body dysmorphia, or fashion trends.

Unless this trend, life style, or whatever you want to call it, is opened up again then children wont see that it is quite possible to be an every day member of society.

The world didn't fall apart when women started wearing trouser suits, and (some) men stopped wearing ties (in western consumer societies).

We are supposed to be better educated, with acess to a far large range of information via the internet, but instead seem to have reverted to some sort of strict Victorian idea of how you fit into society.

I think there have been threads about this on FWR, but until this is seen, once again, as being not only natural but also desirable, it is all too easy for children to feel they must fit into the reactionary straightjacket of queer trans arguement.

Just felt this so strongly (again) when seeing that what seems such a sensible low key response has kicked off the usual outcry.

It is not emphasised enough is that Streeting had a bruising election in which his majority was reduced to 500 from 5000.

Full Ilford North results as Wes Streeting narrowly avoids shock loss

He was a targeted by a Muslim independent which focused on his Israel/Gaza position which was similar to most of Labour, but for various reasons he became a big target over it. However he was too moderate and was targeted since last October:

Ilford North MP Wes Streeting hits out at hostage poster
24th February
https://www.ilfordrecorder.co.uk/news/24141793.ilford-north-mp-wes-streeting-hits-hostage-poster/

‘Complacency terrifies me’: on the doorstep with Labour’s Wes Streeting
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jun/28/risk-complacency-on-election-campaign-trail-labour-wes-streeting

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jun/25/leanne-mohamad-british-palestinian-independent-labour-wes-streeting-ilford-north

However the campaign against Streeting focused on other stuff too.
The wider left also claimed Streeting was going to destroy NHS.
That he hated "trans" people.
That he was a key figure in stopping Corbyn.
That he was the "wrong sort" of gay man.

He had a lot of online abuse. TRAs were prominent in targeting him to lose his seat. It is similar to the way Jess Phillipis was targeted too.

Streeting has come through, but the TRAs made this personal for last year or so. That may come back to haunt them.

‘People feel very betrayed’: the British Palestinian out to unseat Labour’s Wes Streeting in Ilford

Leanne Mohamad gave up her Labour membership last year and believes she is in a two-horse race in east London seat

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jun/25/leanne-mohamad-british-palestinian-independent-labour-wes-streeting-ilford-north

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 14/07/2024 21:11

That he hated "trans" people.
That he was the "wrong sort" of gay man.

You can see some of these ideas over on Reddit. The posts there aren't even making arguments, they're just vicious, seemingly for the sake of being vicious (I cannot think of another reason):

"If this is how Wes Quisling treats his own community, what's he going to do to people he hates? fuckin flay them alive??"

Replies to this:

“We're not his community at all. His community is the conservative Christian community he just happens to also be gay. He did a big "it was so hard for me to accept that I'm gay because or my religion" bollocks. If it was that hard for him to accept himself, what hope do others have of overriding his conservative religious views? He just ain't one of us at all."

“Streeting is the LGBTQ equivalent of Patel and Braverman. Benefit from something when they are younger and then once they get power completely fuck over the people in your community.”

www.reddit.com/r/LabourUK/s/YaP6VmdUhH