New secondary school has a "Queer Club", would you potentially be concerned about this and what questions or steps would you take?

[Valdor]

Hello everyone,

Leafing through the new school materials I have in preparation for my child to attend in September, I was looking for information on the basketball club (which, to my disappointment, is only a 20-minute session once a week). However, I also found information about a “Queer Club,” which meets for 35 minutes weekly. There were no further details provided about this club, though I have asked the school for some.

Now, I, as I’m sure some of you, have concerns about the way queer and trans ideology has been taught in schools over the past 5-8 years. This includes the celebration, self-diagnosis, transitioning, and medicalisation aspects.

At the same time, I want to clarify that I am completely supportive of same-sex attracted, non-stereotypical children and am entirely opposed to rigid gender norms.

What concerns, if any, would you have about this club? What questions would you be asking the school to ensure it is safe and fit for purpose?

I’m looking for some guidance on how to approach this with the school and to make sure our children are in a supportive and safe environment.

Thank you for your insights!

Ask if it's supervised

I think many/most secondary schools will have this kind of club - not necessarily called Queer Club, but a voluntary lunchtime club aimed at LGBT students.

At our school it is called the gay-straight alliance club. I have absolutely no concerns. It is a great group of mostly ND teens.

They support one another very well. I’ve heard some of what some of them have dealt with in terms of sexuality. Things like Boys saying they will make a girl stop being a lesbian. I heard that revelation from one teen in my car and the other kids I was driving Instantly were ready to support in a myriad of ways. Having a strong social circle is really useful.

Well indeed - I am not saying the clubs themselves are a problem, but my real concerns lay around how much safeguarding there is, if it aligns with the draft schools guidance on transgender children, how well it aligns with the Cass review and in fact how well it aligns with the ECHR.

Are there support materials that link to LBG alliance? Or is it just Stonewall? Does the club actively push back against gender stereotypes or not? That sort of thing

Trawl further through the feminism sub where you have posted. Someone is going through the same thing and there were many helpful points to consider raised.

Who runs this club?
What are their qualifications?
Do you as the parents trust the qualifications?
What are the ages of the kids involved?

I understand Safe schools alliance has material (have I got that right) as does Genspect.

Sorry for my grammar today.

I'd be asking a number of questions:

1. How are sex, sexual identity and gender identity covered? (There are clear guidelines for schools about talking to children about sex.
2. What resources are used? Is there a "curriculum?
3. What ages is this for? If it's mixed age, what safeguarding procedures are in place to ensure that all discussions are age appropriate for the youngest of children?
4. Are there measures in place to ensure that discussions about sex, sexuality and sexual attraction don't lead to older students and adults being accused of sexually grooming younger children?
5. Does the school run a "Straight" group for children to discuss their emerging sexuality / sexual relationships etc? If not, why not?
6. What senior staff oversight is there of this group ?
7. Is the school confident that children are not being fed inaccurate information about "changing sex"? Can they guarantee that the group will not generate "social contagion"?

Off the top of my head..

There's a massive naivety in some schools about setting these up and they're potentially opening up older students and adults to all sorts of career ending / criminal allegations.

Take a look at this thread OP.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5102085-heellp-my-14-year-old-daughter-says-she-wants-to-socially-transition?page=1

The one at my DD’s school is run by the students. There is teacher advisor who oversees and makes sure nothing goes off the rails. They have no outside affiliations. They do a mix of things like presentations on history, talks about politics, and craft projects. Sometimes they have picnics.

I think it will very much depend on who, if anyone, is leading the group.

I'm aware of an LGBTQ lunchtime club, at a secondary girls school, the 'leader' of which was a trans identified male; who suggested to some pupils that they " may be trans". This group incliuded not only young lesbians but also some girls from troubled/unstable backgrounds who would be very vulnerable to such suggestions.

...These are just the sort of concerns I have yes....

I don't think schools should have any clubs based around sexual identity.
Schools are for children.
Sex is for adults.

Adolescents do not need to explore their developing sexual feelings in school.
It's not what school is for.
It's unnecessary and potentially dangerous.

But I seem to be a tiny minority in this view these days. Most people seem to think sexual identity clubs are necessary for children in schools.
But I think the world's gone mad.

These clubs are not "about sex". They're safe spaces for young people who are gay and want to meet with others who are similar and won't judge. They usually learn a bit of History and Current Affairs, discuss how to be safe, and just have a friendship group. It will be overseen by a teacher. There is no other agenda.

It depends on the teacher.....see my post above.

What you don't want is your young gay son or lesbian daughter having it suggested to them that they " might really be trans".

The teacher would be breaking every safeguarding rule, then.
If a teacher said that, then report them..

But the "criteria" for them is about sexuality.
Why is it not OK for Mr Perkins to set up a club for Year 9 and 10 straight girls to discuss their heterosexuality with others who are similar and won't judge?

Can you explain the difference?

Yes I can. Children who feel that they are gay are often lonely and isolated. They report bullying and unhappiness at school. These clubs are designed to give them a safe space, and to feel confident about themselves. There is no "sexual" agenda, no weird cult.
If teenage girls are heterosexual, there's usually not a problem because it's a societal "norm". There are often girls' groups, however, run by women teachers to provide a safe space and discussion for girls who feel lonely and/or bullied. Schools try to help vulnerable students.

I still wince at the word "queer". Still remember when it was a slur/hate word slung at gay people.

I would counter that actual gay kids do indeed feel lonely and isolated, because they are same-sex attracted, which many these days declare "bigoted/transphobic".

@YouJustDoYou - I'm not sure that I understand your point, sorry? Yes, a lot of them are unhappy and stressed, feel negative about themselves and feel as if they don't fit in. Just a harmless, kind, friendly lunchtime group can be a little oasis for these children.
We get parents complaining, of course, mostly for religious reasons, if their religion does not accept homosexuality.

Being gay is about sexual attraction.
You can't have a club based around sexual identity and say it's not about sex.

I don't think it's good for children to be expressing sexuality in school. I don't think it's good for kids to make sexual attraction a core part of their identity.

I don't getting kids together based on a desire for an activity they are not yet legally allowed to take part in is dangerous sexualising of kids.

Kids are so sexualised these days and LGBT seems to provide a 'progressive' way to link kids and sex. With adult consent and encouragement.

Sex is for adults .
School is for learning.

Weekends with peer groups are for expressing yourself.

I know I'm way off the general current thinking on this but I think the current ways we 'support' kids are so detrimental in so many ways.

It's not about sex as an activity. They don't discuss sex. That's not allowed in this situation.
It's a gentle, kind space for unhappy, lonely and bullied children. They don't have to share anything of themselves. They seem to like playing jenga.
I have no idea why this sort of club is being regarded as so bad on here. The worst criticism of it that we get has come from religious parents. It's sad.

No kids should be bullied.
Homophobic bullying should not be tolerated at all. A club shouldn't be needed for that.

A group in school for children based on their sexual attraction and run by an adult... another thing we'll look back on and think; why did anyone think that was a good idea??

It's only seemed like a good idea for the last 2 mins and there's maybe been a reason for that.
We're now so 'tolerant' our brains have fallen out.

I genuinely think some people are way off the mark with what goes on in schools and I've no idea why.
Apart from the religious fundamentalists.

Lots of children feel isolated and lonely and are bullied for a myriad of reasons. Dividing children up on the basis of sexuality (especially children below the age of consent) for support is a naive response imho
Schools are communities where adults should be fostering tolerance and mutual respect between children. You need to be very careful setting up groups that target children on the basis of difference. I'm not saying it can't or should never be done and if the data shows that a school has lots of homophobic bullying that staff aren't tackling, then that might make a case for a special safe place for those children. If the school has a range of specialist groups for children with different protected characteristics, then one for under 16s wondering about their sexuality might be reasonable if you can satisfy all the safeguarding hazards.

But I'd put money on it that most of these groups are in reality the pet projects of self interested adults and nothing to do with the actual learning or social / emotional needs of children in the school. .

It's a gentle, kind space for unhappy, lonely and bullied children.

No it's not. Its a club for children based on their sexual identity.
Or do you not let confident happy gay kids join?