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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
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8
LaLoba · 28/04/2024 08:42

‘His instincts went back to old ties of solidarity against discrimination.’

Funny how these men never seem to have any concern about discrimination against women. They just leap at the chance to tell us to shut up.

Woman2023 · 28/04/2024 08:46

Interesting to read. Thanks.

Incredible how he says he agrees with Rowling and Bindel but argues against them. Make it make sense!

He still doesn't get that all the women who've raised the alarm about "trans kids" are trying to save the kids from harm while idiots like him were happily cheering it on unquestioningly.

TooMinty · 28/04/2024 08:52

I thought that was a really interesting and balanced interview, an example of good journalism that I think we need more of these days.
For BB, I think it's the lure of "being relevant" - he's had a taste of fame built on speaking out and being a voice of the underdog which is great but he's not really ready to give that up and pass it on to the new generations, whatever he says here!

Mumoftwo1312 · 28/04/2024 08:53

This is spot on:

His argument is that some of his opponents on the issue appear to be giving strength to anti-trans campaigns on the fundamentalist religious right in the US and elsewhere – that if any ground is given “the next thing will be an assault on equal marriage and abortion”. But of course there is no suggestion at all that Rowling or Bindel have any sympathy with those groups so, again, isn’t that a problem of social media platforms themselves, which are engineered to promote simple binaries over nuanced argument, and which reinforce “which side are you on” tribalism.
He seems to agree, when we talk, that it might be better to aim fire at those extremist reactionary groups but reserves his right to defend his corner if “people are spitting at him” on X.

Basically, there are some men out there who simply envy and resent successful, influential women. So they contort reasons to argue with them, in this case the notion that fundamental religious groups agree with them. But they don't attack the fundamental religious groups themselves (which are headed up by men).

If it walks and quacks like a misogynist...

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 28/04/2024 08:53

Bottom line is, he's not very bright and he's extremely obstinate and opinionated. The journalist is absolutely right when he says that X/Twitter is not a good place for a nuanced, complex debate. Won't stop Bragg, though.

BonnyBo · 28/04/2024 09:08

Woman2023 · 28/04/2024 08:46

Interesting to read. Thanks.

Incredible how he says he agrees with Rowling and Bindel but argues against them. Make it make sense!

He still doesn't get that all the women who've raised the alarm about "trans kids" are trying to save the kids from harm while idiots like him were happily cheering it on unquestioningly.

As Kathleen stock said on x:

“Transphobic bigots” in the tweets, “reasonable disagreement” in the broadsheets

BathshebaEverdene1 · 28/04/2024 09:15

He is a bit...." intellectually challenged" isn't he?
No idea why this washed up old has-been even thinks he is remotely relevant

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 28/04/2024 09:26

BonnyBo · 28/04/2024 09:08

As Kathleen stock said on x:

“Transphobic bigots” in the tweets, “reasonable disagreement” in the broadsheets

Brilliant!

RedToothBrush · 28/04/2024 09:42

BonnyBo · 28/04/2024 09:08

As Kathleen stock said on x:

“Transphobic bigots” in the tweets, “reasonable disagreement” in the broadsheets

Amazing.

It's always struck me one of the reasons MN has such value is because it's not restrictive of debate by characters.

That's why it's hated so much.

I think it's easier to control populations on twitter for that reason.

That's also why I think the US government wants to shut down MN because it can't control it. Unlike other social media it's not US based and it can't be influenced quite as easily on key election issues.

Abortion remains one of those crucial US issues and trans issues will be significant this time around. MN therefore stands out as a power point the US government would wish to manage.

Rightsraptor · 28/04/2024 09:48

Billy Bragg is still in the 20th century.

sashagabadon · 28/04/2024 09:51

It seems to me that arguing with him is an utter waste of time. He’ll never agree so don’t waste energy trying to persuade him

allnewfor2024 · 28/04/2024 09:54

Brilliant.
The worst he could throw at JKR and JB is that they’re ‘sitting with the wrong people’.

Runor · 28/04/2024 09:58

So GC feminists happen to agree on a single point (usually for very different reasons) with some “bad people” so they must budge up and relinquish women’s sex-based rights?

Yeah, no. Try applying some critical thinking and produce an actual reasoned argument if you want to change people’s opinions Bragg!

Oblomov24 · 28/04/2024 10:01

People say he's not very bright, don't they?

IDoNotConsentToAstonResearch · 28/04/2024 10:04

sashagabadon · 28/04/2024 09:51

It seems to me that arguing with him is an utter waste of time. He’ll never agree so don’t waste energy trying to persuade him

Yes and no matter how much the evidence stacks up he is never going to have either the grace or the self knowledge to admit he’s wrong. He’ll just be forced into ever more absurd corners like the table thing or coming up with random misrepresentations of Cass.

illinivich · 28/04/2024 10:06

It reminds me of a TV debate I did back with Red Wedge; on one side of the table was me, Jerry Dammers and Clare Short, and on the other Stewart Copeland, a Tory MP called Greg Knight and Chris Dean from the Redskins. Now, me and Chris had toured during the miners’ strike, but I looked at Chris, and pointed to who he was sitting with, and told him he was on the wrong side of the table. And that’s what I see with Rowling and the others: they are on the wrong side of the table.”

Great anecdote billy, classic debate.

All thats proved is that he's always followed a crowd and not the argument.

theDudesmummy · 28/04/2024 10:10

"Wrong side of the table"? What a silly thing to say.

teawamutu · 28/04/2024 10:10

Argument at the 'they've got the cooties so you do too' level of debate.

What a prize cockwomble.

Is he now going to catch a load of flak for being a transphobe from his following? I do hope so.

Oblomov24 · 28/04/2024 10:12

"Rowling and the others: they are on the wrong side of the table.”

Nope. I don't agree.

Maaate · 28/04/2024 10:12

Oh is Silly Billy starting to realise the wind has changed and trying to backtrack?

sashagabadon · 28/04/2024 10:12

theDudesmummy · 28/04/2024 10:10

"Wrong side of the table"? What a silly thing to say.

I assume that is because he really wanted to say wrong side of history but as they are proving to be on the right side of history he can’t 😂

teawamutu · 28/04/2024 10:16

sashagabadon · 28/04/2024 10:12

I assume that is because he really wanted to say wrong side of history but as they are proving to be on the right side of history he can’t 😂

Yeah, we've been reassigned as 'right, but in the wrong way/standing next to the wrong people/at the wrong time'.

I need a new word that encompasses the full extent of the hard-of-thinking, sexist, self-satisfied dickheadry of Bragg, Campbell, Hislop etc al. None of the ones I already know are coming close to cutting it.

RandySavage · 28/04/2024 10:21

Funny how politely Billy argues with a male journalist, eh?

If I were Billy I'd maybe look at some of the people I was sitting with. He's on the same side of the table as Isla Bryson, Barbie Kardashian, Dana Rivers and Sandi Toksvig - surely that's enough to make anyone question themselves.

RebelliousCow · 28/04/2024 10:30

It is embarrassing how much he has made this his issue, whilst understanding so little of it - beyond the most rudimentary "supporting the marginalised"

teawamutu · 28/04/2024 10:31

RandySavage · 28/04/2024 10:21

Funny how politely Billy argues with a male journalist, eh?

If I were Billy I'd maybe look at some of the people I was sitting with. He's on the same side of the table as Isla Bryson, Barbie Kardashian, Dana Rivers and Sandi Toksvig - surely that's enough to make anyone question themselves.

Why does that never occur to them? Genuine question.

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