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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Police Scotland include sex shop in list of locations where you can report a hate crime

115 replies

inkjet · 13/03/2024 14:53

Taken from Twitter -
https://twitter.com/blablafishcakes/status/1767872003015315532

The list of third party reporting centres are here -
https://www.scotland.police.uk/spa-media/a1epy5nr/greater-glasgow.docx

https://www.scotland.police.uk/spa-media/a1epy5nr/greater-glasgow.docx

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
ArabellaScott · 14/03/2024 09:37

Ah! At last, I've found the legislation online rather than on a bloody pdf. I'm just going to post the whole thing here:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/part/3/crossheading/offences-of-stirring-up-hatred

4Offences of stirring up hatred

(1)A person commits an offence if—

(a)the person—

(i)behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening, abusive or insulting, or

(ii)communicates to another person material that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening, abusive or insulting, and

(b)either—

(i)in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against a group of persons based on the group being defined by reference to race, colour, nationality (including citizenship), or ethnic or national origins, or

(ii)a reasonable person would consider the behaviour or the communication of the material to be likely to result in hatred being stirred up against such a group.

(2)A person commits an offence if—

(a)the person—

(i)behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, or

(ii)communicates to another person material that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, and

(b)in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against a group of persons based on the group being defined by reference to a characteristic mentioned in subsection (3).

(3)The characteristics are—

(a)age,

(b)disability,

(c)religion or, in the case of a social or cultural group, perceived religious affiliation,

(d)sexual orientation,

(e)transgender identity,

(f)variations in sex characteristics.

(4)It is a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to show that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable.

(5)For the purposes of subsection (4), in determining whether behaviour or communication was reasonable, particular regard must be had to the importance of the right to freedom of expression by virtue of Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights, including the general principle that the right applies to the expression of information or ideas that offend, shock or disturb.

(6)For the purposes of subsection (4), it is shown that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable if—

(a)evidence adduced is enough to raise an issue as to whether that is the case, and

(b)the prosecution does not prove beyond reasonable doubt that it is not the case.

(7)For the purposes of subsections (1)(a)(i) and (2)(a)(i), a person's behaviour—

(a)includes behaviour of any kind and, in particular, things that the person says, or otherwise communicates, as well as things that the person does,

(b)may consist of—

(i)a single act, or

(ii)a course of conduct.

(8)For the purposes of subsections (1)(a)(ii) and (2)(a)(ii), the ways in which a person may communicate material to another person are by—

(a)displaying, publishing or distributing the material,

(b)giving, sending, showing or playing the material to another person,

(c)making the material available to another person in any other way.

(9)A person who commits an offence under this section is liable—

(a)on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 12 months or a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum (or both), or

(b)on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years or a fine (or both).

Hate Crime and Public Order (Scotland) Act 2021

An Act of the Scottish Parliament to make provision about the aggravation of offences by prejudice; to make provision about an offence of racially aggravated harassment; to make provision about offences relating to stirring up hatred against a group of...

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/part/3/crossheading/offences-of-stirring-up-hatred

littlbrowndog · 14/03/2024 09:39

Jane in Glasgow. On radio Scotland. 👏👏👏👏

she just said that the only protected charesticst not included in the law is sex
and she did not believe that Scottish Government will bring in a law to protect women

and she also said the SG does not even know what a women is so how can women be protected if they don’t know what a women is

Datun · 14/03/2024 10:15

(1)A person commits an offence if—

(a)the person—

(i)behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening, abusive or insulting, or

Every single transactivist in the country will be reporting everything that women say. India Willoughby will be setting up camp outside the mushroom farm/sex shop with a list as long as your arm about J. K. Rowling.

And of course they're all going to say they're insulted. Their entire schtick from one end to the other relies on the denial of reality. Anything short of 100% compliance is not acceptable.

Every single outlet will be inundated.

Which would appear to be the entire purpose of the scheme.

Within those parameters, I can't see how J. K. Rowling won't be arrested.

When you redefine the meaning of all words, including hate, that's what you'll get.

It also makes sense of India Willoughby claiming they had received so much 'hate' on the back of J. K. Rowling's tweets. Without showing any, of course.

Willoughby is being briefed by TRAs much cleverer than Willoughby, ahead of the law.

It's going to be a full-time job for transactactivist to set up anonymous accounts to 'hate' on their mates, in order to prove their mates' bogus assertions.

This depth of lunacy almost makes me look forward to the headlines.

SirChenjins · 14/03/2024 10:21

I can imagine there are lawyers on both sides who are rubbing their hands at the thought of what’s ahead for them £££

From now on I am identifying as a GC non binary person.

littlbrowndog · 14/03/2024 10:35

Police federation said this morning they are not happy with this

police Scotland get only 2 hours online training on the law for this

and they don’t have enough officers to deal with this

WickedSerious · 14/03/2024 10:37

littlbrowndog · 14/03/2024 10:35

Police federation said this morning they are not happy with this

police Scotland get only 2 hours online training on the law for this

and they don’t have enough officers to deal with this

Oh dear.what a pity.

FrancescaContini · 14/03/2024 10:43

ArabellaScott · 14/03/2024 09:34

I'm actually not sure if that's quite correct. That's the case for existing UK law, as I understand it.

The new offence of 'stirring up hatred' is not a Non Crime Hate Incident, it's an actual criminal offence.

Existing law allows for a 'hate crime' aggravator.

The new Bill has this as part 1, but part 2 is creating a new offence. 'Stirring Up hatred'. This is punishable by prison time.

As ever, not a lawyer, would be REALLY happy to be corrected.

I quoted from the Herald article. It sounds as if there’s a lot of confusion around this. I wonder why…

Brefugee · 14/03/2024 11:27

SirChenjins · 14/03/2024 10:21

I can imagine there are lawyers on both sides who are rubbing their hands at the thought of what’s ahead for them £££

From now on I am identifying as a GC non binary person.

Edited

Why not just identify as a trans woman? That isn't defined either

SirChenjins · 14/03/2024 12:02

Brefugee · 14/03/2024 11:27

Why not just identify as a trans woman? That isn't defined either

I could - but then my lack of lipstick and blouses might raise suspicions.

Brefugee · 14/03/2024 12:16

There are enough videos of how to do it on TikTok 😜

SoupDragonsFriend · 14/03/2024 12:29

Job application for mushroom farm worker:

Essential experience and skills
Good command of English
Good hand-eye coordination
Ability to work as part of a team and independently
Previous experience of crisis management
Previous experience of harvesting and packing fresh fruit or vegetables, preferably mushrooms
Proven ability to record traumatic reports accurately in writing (this will be checked as part of the interview process)
Good health and safety awareness in relation to fruit or vegetable harvesting by hand
Previous experience of trauma counselling in person and by telephone
Excellent understanding of confidentiality
Accurate, up-to-date understanding of Scottish law as it applies to hate crimes and a willingness to undertake training to accommodate any future changes in the law.

Desirable experience and qualifications
Basic food hygiene certificate
Recent electric and pedestrian pallet truck training
Training in identifying diseases and pests in mushrooms
A postgraduate qualification in law, counselling, psychology or similar
A sympathetic personality
Own transport (public transport is limited)

FrancescaContini · 14/03/2024 12:39

Pay: National Minimum Wage (if you’re lucky)

ArabellaScott · 14/03/2024 12:41

https://twitter.com/ScotsPolFed/status/1768206729550901534

'SNP ministers have been warned that people could be wrongly charged under <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.is/o/m9JiT/www.scotsman.com/news/politics/hate-crime-act-scotland-concerns-raised-as-controversial-new-laws-due-to-come-into-force-4551185" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">new hate crime legislation because officers are “unprepared” to enforce the legislation.'

'David Kennedy, the general secretary of the Scottish Police Federation (SPF), told The Scotsman the online training packages that officers had undertaken were “just not going to be good enough”.
He said: “In years gone by, there had been a proper training course. You don’t get that from an online training exercise. We have stated previously that the online training is not fit for purpose.”
Mr Kennedy added: “Police are going to be inundated with people wanting to <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.is/o/m9JiT/www.scotsman.com/news/politics/hate-crime-law-glasgow-lgbt-sex-shop-designated-official-reporting-centre-for-controversial-new-laws-4553231" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">report a hate crime. We need to make sure the public understand the Act. It certainly won’t be an easy Act to understand.”
Mr Kennedy warned “the police are overstretched as it is”. He added: “People will expect certain actions to take place into the policing of the hate crime laws.”'

https://twitter.com/ScotsPolFed/status/1768206729550901534

Gettingonmygoat · 14/03/2024 12:41

ArabellaScott · 13/03/2024 17:25

As noted by many, Police Scotland are currently closing police stations nationwide.

I suppose replacing them with ... mushroom farms and sex shops ... is somewhat appropriate.

We must be he exception here in South Ayrshire. We have a new Police station! Well it is building where the coppers congregate, it has a lovely new gym. Muslim washing room and LGBT+ friendly staff room. The only thing missing from this Police station is a cell. The didn't think having a room to lock dangerous criminals in was appropriate !

ADHDAHA · 14/03/2024 12:52

Maybe the thinking is that gay men and sex workers visit these shops. They might be subject to hate crimes based on homophobia - or sex workers might get called ‘whores’ and ‘prossies’ which is deemed insulting as it’s now ‘sex work’ and sex work is work. Can’t quite see the reasoning for a mushroom farm. A hairdressers might be good place for women to report a hate crime/domestic abuse but… oh yeah misogyny and hate crimes based on being female aren’t included in the Hate crime bill are they?? I’m sorry if I’ve misunderstood.

littlbrowndog · 14/03/2024 12:54

From Twitter below

Police Scotland include sex shop in list of locations where you can report a hate crime
Police Scotland include sex shop in list of locations where you can report a hate crime
SirChenjins · 14/03/2024 12:57

Gettingonmygoat · 14/03/2024 12:41

We must be he exception here in South Ayrshire. We have a new Police station! Well it is building where the coppers congregate, it has a lovely new gym. Muslim washing room and LGBT+ friendly staff room. The only thing missing from this Police station is a cell. The didn't think having a room to lock dangerous criminals in was appropriate !

Not quite new! It used to be a council building and the Police moved into after their previous premises became too old/unsuitable, and it's not a LGetc staff room, it's gender neutral changing facility for LGetc staff.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/03/2024 12:59

or sex workers might get called ‘whores’ and ‘prossies’

Not covered under hate crime law. They would have to have one of the monitored strands.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 14/03/2024 13:05

MyLadyDisdainlsYetLiving · 13/03/2024 18:08

Fucking hell. I mean, I’ve visited the Stasi museum in Berlin and I’ve actually learned from history unlike some others in power.

You know the quote about what happens to people who don't learn from history, don't you?

I know I've said this before - in fact I have, many times - but how do so many people this bloody stupid get to positions of power?

littlbrowndog · 14/03/2024 13:26

Query 4 - hate crime against white young men ✊

crunchermuncher · 14/03/2024 13:36

So if I've read that excerpt correctly, a person could be prosecuted and I'm fact go to jail for one incident of saying something that someone (in one of the recognised groups) found insulting?

Insulting?

I understand the thinking behind prohibiting abuse and threats but one off insults? Is that a good use of police time?

Also, race seems to be a glaring omission from that list (or is that covered by 'cultural group')?

MyLadyDisdainlsYetLiving · 14/03/2024 13:51

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 14/03/2024 13:05

You know the quote about what happens to people who don't learn from history, don't you?

I know I've said this before - in fact I have, many times - but how do so many people this bloody stupid get to positions of power?

Well exactly. On both your points.

My late dad used to read the paper every day, and he used to mutter that the world is going to rack and ruin wherever the latest scandal broke. We’d roll our eyes and humour him out of it. Ten years later I look at the news and think, you were right dad, just a bit early.

I think it’s all part of this post-logic, post- facts world we now live in. The Age of Reason ended in 2016, we have now entered the Age of Feelings. Somehow we’ve collectively lost the ability to see the grey - eg you can like someone but disagree with something they say on a topic, or acknowledge that someone you dislike has done a good thing. People seeking power are no longer required to be honourable, honest people, let alone clever or knowledgeable. We have lost our trust in the very institutions that used to be essential fabric at the core of our society such as the police and the BBC and the post office. The ability to hold people’s and institutions to account and get customer service is reliant on making a complaint on social media and whipping up a mob. God* Help Us All.

*Other deities are available.

anothernamitynamenamechange · 14/03/2024 13:57

ADHDAHA · 14/03/2024 12:52

Maybe the thinking is that gay men and sex workers visit these shops. They might be subject to hate crimes based on homophobia - or sex workers might get called ‘whores’ and ‘prossies’ which is deemed insulting as it’s now ‘sex work’ and sex work is work. Can’t quite see the reasoning for a mushroom farm. A hairdressers might be good place for women to report a hate crime/domestic abuse but… oh yeah misogyny and hate crimes based on being female aren’t included in the Hate crime bill are they?? I’m sorry if I’ve misunderstood.

To be fair calling someone a whore is abusive.

But if a violent "customer" tries to rape or strangle you then the police will definitely be right on that in a couple of decades/BBC exposes...
If called a prossie/whore however you can report that immediately at a variety of locations and it WILL be prioritised.

ArabellaScott · 14/03/2024 13:58

crunchermuncher · 14/03/2024 13:36

So if I've read that excerpt correctly, a person could be prosecuted and I'm fact go to jail for one incident of saying something that someone (in one of the recognised groups) found insulting?

Insulting?

I understand the thinking behind prohibiting abuse and threats but one off insults? Is that a good use of police time?

Also, race seems to be a glaring omission from that list (or is that covered by 'cultural group')?

Race is covered separately.

'Offence of racially aggravated harassment'

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/part/2

Hate Crime and Public Order (Scotland) Act 2021

An Act of the Scottish Parliament to make provision about the aggravation of offences by prejudice; to make provision about an offence of racially aggravated harassment; to make provision about offences relating to stirring up hatred against a group of...

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/part/2

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