Katy Jon Went interviewed on Heretics

[ANameChangePresents]

It's the most click-baity video title ever...

I Tell Trans Person A Very Difficult TRUTH (Heated!)

Currently watching this and thus far Gold hasn't really challenged Went that strongly, which I mean, is reasonable. It's not a boxing match. That said Went has deployed a tonne of tripe so far dressed up as 'reasonable'.

The argument that 'life is all about accommodating each other' (using religion coexistence as a metaphor) fails to mention how the accomodation in this instance is entirely one damn way...

If anything else (positive or negative) crops up, I'll post. Summary at the end.

Has anyone else here watched this yet?

I've been watching too but had to turn off. It's like watching an old, seedy, beery, manipulative, gaslighting ex who thinks they are so much more clever than you. I don't want to listen to that shite anymore, it's so boring. I, and I'm sure you, have heard it all before.

Yes. I'm swallowing buckets of cringe.

I'm finding Went using stories of his handmaidens vouching for Wentself as credibility currency annoying. Went's friends not caring that they break boundaries isn't implicit permission for all trans people to break all boundaries.

The story about voluntarily breaking the rules at Ballentine's Gym says it all to me. It's all about Went, all day, every day.

Yes Andrew,this is very much a fetish.

I can't cope with the thumbs. Shudder

I thought it was interesting, there was a number of things he said. That i picked up upon.

He talked about gender dysphoria, trans euphoria, then what i prefer which is body dysmorphia. Wonder when that slight of language occurred.

He talked about “old school” trans

very honest about his position in the past changing, recognising GC arguments.

Makes me wonder if, that when AGP is treated with hormones, it subsides after long term treatment, and they see reason, and if that is what old school means.

fudged a bit

but overall i did not mind him.

I dunno; Went is just another Hayton in my view: scared that self-ID will ruin the current setup that suits Went. Therefore, Went is all about arguing for accommodating 'TruTrans' who claim access to womanhood on the basis of a more successful mimicry (i.e. full surgery and presentation).

Went claims to respect women’s views but that doesn’t seem to include actually listening to the women telling Went to stop using women’s spaces or Went stopping speaking over women in debates.

Went & Hayton et al are involved in public campaigning for what suits their needs/wants and are not concerned about what is best for women’s needs. Appearing friendly and sympathetic towards women is part of that approach.

Went & Hayton et al are involved in public campaigning for what suits their needs/wants and are not concerned about what is best for women’s needs. Appearing friendly and sympathetic towards women is part of that approach.

And they both seem to be saying the same thing in terms of spaces. Hayton says he goes into female spaces when his women friends invite him in.

Which looks remarkably like this from the OP

I'm finding Went using stories of his handmaidens vouching for Wentself as credibility currency annoying. Went's friends not caring that they break boundaries isn't implicit permission for all trans people to break all boundaries.

Perhaps it's a known thing to say.

If women, who I promise are feminists, say it's fine, then it must be fine.

And we know it works the other way, too. If this trans person says they agree with us, then it must be fine.

I quite like Andrew Gold but I do find he doesn't do much research and he doesn't ask hard questions.

I'm quite new to the debate and I don't think this was good for newbies. Andrew didn't ask many questions it was almost a very long navel gazing monologue so I lost Wents train of arguement a lot and gave up half way through.

Their attitude to single sex changing rooms is abhorrent . It is okay because a female friend invited them and they used a cubicle. Did the other women using the changing room consent to them being there?

It all about him. He doesn’t want to go into men changing rooms. Fine but don’t use female facilities.

I've never been a part of 'feminist' circles, but I always assumed they were pushing for fairness for women, so I would always describe myself as a feminist.

Now I'm wondering wtf do 'feminists' think they're doing?

See also Julie Bindel interviewing Hayton about his book. Just why give him the airtime?

Cringe? Creepy?

Maybe

Referring to the surgical altered penis as a clitoris? The pizza I had for tea nearly reappeared with much vigour.

I saw this yesterday and decided to give it a miss. I usually like Andrew Gold but I cannot sit there for nearly an hour listening to these guys.

I did see a clip on twitter where he said he has had an upgrade to his penis in the form of a clitorus?

Yeah, no pal.

Watched this, I really can't take anything they said too seriously. AGPs lie, lie and then lie again, so it becomes their truth.
He did go on about his breasts quite a bit, for reasons ???!!!!
The whole interview seemed like a chance for him to give a PR spin on why he, and not other men in dresses, should be in womens only spaces and accepted as female. Their worst fear must be to be in the ladies and it be full of other AGPs. A bit like going to a gay women's event and there being no real women there to be validated by.

In his head he wants be the only Trans Woman, and will throw others like him right under the bus. See India Willoughby and Debbie Hayton for the same tactics and examples of how its all the Self.

He did go on about his breasts quite a bit, for reasons ???!!!!

The clip i saw was went claiming he couldnt use mens changing rooms because he has breasts. He even let us know the size.

I feel like we are being manipulated to seeing the Isla Brysons as the unacceptable men with gender, because they have a criminal record, and the 'with gender' is recently acquired.

Whereas the gay men with gender are ok because they have no interest in us sexually, and straight men with gender and surgery are too busy thinking about their own breasts to see us.

Its all about the risk of assault rather than women having the right to space away from men.

Im not saying this is what Gold is promoting, but to be honest we could stop it all by just saying no to every man with gender, rather than listen to them talk about breasts and how that somehow makes them a different type of man.

Loads of men with what I believe they call 'moobs' use the men's toilets. Some cancer treatments can cause enlarged breast tissue but they still use the men's.

Despicable excuse. But totally expected.

Surely he's not worried that other men will mistake him for a woman?

The clip i saw was went claiming he couldnt use mens changing rooms because he has breasts. He even let us know the size.

There appears be an obsession with breasts.

Perhaps he viewed the same stuff as Debbie Hayton, and thinks that size equals status.

(honestly, it's so like a man to attach status to the size of a body part).

Because woman = breasts. Duhhhh.

Listen, I am bracing myself for a bit of a pile on, but I found it interesting and I found Went reasonable.

Dr Az Hakeem, who is my personal favourite go to expert, did say that AGPs are quite rare, they make up only 5% or do of trans women and most of the others are transvestites who are aroused by the actual women's clothing - be that the fabric or the idea of looking a certain way, rather than wanting actual female body parts, so I reckon it's becoe a bit overused.

And didn't we all say, at the very start, wear what you like, do what you like to yourself, as long as you don't think you are actually a woman and invade our spaces? And Went seems respectful of that. Even going so far as to saying the current trans lobby is overreaching....

Anyway, I thought it was worth watching the whole thing.

And yes, I am gender critical, but I assume at some point we will have to coexist respectfully with trans women and they will be entitled to dress how they like and call themselves what they wish. As long as they don't insist we all have to act as though they believe they are women and as long as there are women only spaces where trans women cannot go, I am fine with that.

*as though WE all believe they are women, that should read.

And didn't we all say, at the very start, wear what you like, do what you like to yourself, as long as you don't think you are actually a woman and invade our spaces? And Went seems respectful of that.

I'm pretty certain just a few posts earlier people are saying that he goes in the ladies because breasts. Which bit of that is respectful of women's spaces?

If that's true it's not respectful at all. There may be a time when Katy can no longer do that, or any other trans woman.

I am watching that bit right now and Katy says there are some men who have refused to share their spaces. I guess men would be more aggressive than women, though.

And Katy did not go swimming and use any changing room for ten years, but has to take up some form of fitness because of diabetes. A lesbian friend accompanied Katy and invited Katy to use the women's changing room with her - wrong of them both, if you ask me, and I would tell Katy so, but gyms, swimming pools etc will need to provide separate facilities at some point.

Anyway, it is an interesting discussion and I don't think we should write off all trans women as being evil self serving men living out a sexual fetish yet. Some of them really do want discussions and solutions because this current state of affairs is no good for them either. We will have to coexist at some point.