Sunak telling Robin White that biological sex is important live on GB news

[fromorbit]

'Particularly when it comes to questions around women's safety and health, biological sex is important.' Parents need to be involved in schools.

Rishi Sunak is asked 'why should LGBT people vote Conservative?'
GB News forum footage here:
https://twitter.com/GBNEWS/status/1757143443111841900

It costs a lot in time to write and communicate policies, answer questions etc. All the school time is tied up in the bare bones of teaching. They can't even deal with children with SEN at the moment as not enough resource.

Anyway this is off topic.
If the Conservatives want this to happen then they need to address the schools funding crisis first.

AdamRyan

In what way is forcing children to affirm another child's "gender" due to lack of resources>
And ditto for these findings

• 72 per cent of schools are teaching that people have a gender identity that may be different from their biological sex
• 25 per cent are teaching that some people or children ‘may be born in the wrong body.’
• 30 per cent are teaching pupils that a person who self- identifies as a man or a woman should be treated as a man or woman in all circumstances, even if this does not match their biological sex.

They are all active steps in affirming a child's "gender identity". And all harmful and nonsensical. How is any of that due to lack of resources? Of course it's an ideological stance!

All the more reason not to invent special rules for a subject of children then?

if you need a policy on gender confused children, then it's a lot easier to to stick to existing well thought out safeguarding rules than throw them out and try to invent something new. Surely?

Agree

Or schools could stop taking on the role of medical judge and jury. If they're so stretched.

So, you have a blanket prejudice on everything they publish and you will reject anything they recommend.

Do you feel that is an objective way to deal with information that they can provide? Rather than reading it and assessing a report that might be presenting interesting and accurate information that has not been published before? You said that you recommend people do their due diligence, then you post that you will automatically discount anything published by anyone connected to Tufton Street. I am pointing out that this is an inconsistent view.

No, you are not stopping me engaging with them. Plus I keep repeating that you are very free to post your opinions. However, this is a public forum board and if you post your opinions, expect people to engage and challenge them.

Do people actually read what they write?
But it doesn't cost anything to say toilets and changing rooms and sports are single sex, and involve parents before socially transitioning.
Yes it does. You have to write it in a policy. You have to engage with parents in a way that could potentially be very time consuming.

Any change at work takes time and resource. Doesn't matter how sensible it is. Schools have the currently pressing issue of how to stay open.

Anyway, massive derail. I'm not going to dig into the ons and outs of the findings on this thread. Happy to discuss on another though.

And yet, they have already done in previously based on information that is now deemed as being incorrect.

Do you think that schools should not now address a harmful policy based on current guidance because some posters believe it is not impacting anyone they know?

Do you honestly think that schools should present materials in schools that they have sourced from outside organisations that present information that contradicts the findings of the interim Cass Report? And that schools should not have a responsibility to be very clear and honest with parents about what they are teaching in lessons?

RM made herself look such a chancer with that question. Might as well have conflated 'T' issues with the cost of living crisis or the invasion of Ukraine for all the T has in common with LGB.

This is not a derail. This is actually addressing what Sunak has been talking about.

What part of his answer to White do posters think discussing school guidance is not covered by that answer?

Maybe challenge what I said rather than what you imagine I've said then.
I don't trust them. I've explained why. A reasonable position is not "prejudice".

I would not seek them out as a source and I'd double check any "facts" that came from them.

I've never said I'll "reject everything they recommend". Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

Other posters may not realise that e.g. the Institute for Foreign Affairs is in fact a right wing lobbying group. Therefore they may not realise they are getting a partisan opinion masquerading as objective analysis when they read their report. I think its important for people to be informed about this stuff.

Of course I read what I write!

Schools have had single sex toilets and changing rooms and sports for decades.
Any school that has chosen to diverge from this has done so of their own accord and has disregarded safeguarding.

If a school has changed the name / pronouns of any child that has been at a cost of admin, plus in some cases the pressure on staff/students not to tell the parents.

Any school that has been busy socially transitioning children and brining in anti-safeguarding rules may have a cost of rolling back, but safeguarding is essential is it not?

I agree schools have pressing issues to deal with and insufficient funds, but that is no reason to ignore basic safeguarding rules .

Or they could not have changed any of their policies and incurred time, costs, and now likely the time and cost of reversing it all back to what it should be.

I don't see why anyone but those who bowed and scraped to lobbyists pushing an adult agenda, should have to find the time or money to fix it tbh.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/01/no-10-lobby-groups-democracy-policy-exchange

There is evidence that these lobby groups coordinate their work, creating the impression that people in different places are spontaneously coming to the same conclusions. Several of them work from the same offices, in 55 and 57 Tufton Street, Westminster.The lobby group that Boris Johnson’s government uses most is Policy Exchange. While it claims to be a neutral educational charity, it was founded in 2002 by the Conservative MPs Francis Maude and Archie Norman, and Nick Boles, who later also became a Tory MP. Its first chairman was Michael Gove. Its proposals and personnel have been adopted by the Conservative party ever since.

Are we now at ad locum?

Ok. so Because I dont trust them, I don't bother with them. and "When a think tank says "this is happening in schools" my question would be, is it, or has it happened in one school and it suits the lobby group to exaggerate it?".

"I would then go to other sources to double check. Often these statements turn out to be at best over exaggerated and at worst made up."

"Most of the time I wouldn't bother. Especially with the Tufton Street lot. is not you saying that"

Is not you saying that you reject what they say? And you then telling us that schools could not possibly do any of their recommendations, which look pretty close to the guidance when you look at specific school actions recommended, because funding, is not you dismissing those recommendations?

It is all just you saying that people should do their due diligence and read further before making unfounded comments. Ok. My apologies. I fully agree with you that people should read what others present as evidence (no need to go and search for it) and make a judgement call on that document based on what is presented in that document.

No school has been "busy socially transitioning children", don't be ridiculous.
Teachers are trying their best to manage an epidemic of children self-identifying as trans. Some of those children may be from abusive homes where there are safeguarding concerns about disclosing to parents. Not all children have lovely supportive parents with their children's best interests at heart.

is all just you saying that people should do their due diligence and read further before making unfounded comments. Ok. My apologies. I fully agree with you that people should read what others present as evidence (no need to go and search for it) and make a judgement call on that document based on what is presented in that document.

Yes. But also disagreement isn't always an "unfounded comment". People are allowed different opinions.

No, I doubt they are 'busy' socially transitioning children. But they are doing it.

Can you indicate how many children it is ok for schools to socially transition before we and other parents can ask those schools to make the appropriate changes to stick to the current guidance at the very least?

1 child? 2? Well my teen's school has passed this number.

So, did you read the document linked before making a comment about the recommendations?

Yes they have.
There are threads on MN from parents who have just that happen to their child.

Plus if a school honestly believes parents are a risk, then they should be involving social workers etc, not just doing what the child wants!

This isn't about the reports at all is it? You just want schools to be able to ignore safeguarding when it comes to gender confused children.

No school at all? In the whole of the country? You sure?

We have two TRA teachers at ours who've transed their own kids. At the same time, gender neutral loos have been added which weren't requested, and where the sexes where separated in policy, this has been changed by stealth without parental consultation, to self-identified gender.

Sorry but no. You're not correct here.

This? I wasn't commenting on their recommendations.
I got involved backing up another poster questioning their positioning themselves as a "non-partisan educational charity" when in fact they are a pro-Conservative think tank.
I've already said I'll read the recommendations if you start another thread. Let's not derail this one.

None of that is "schools busily transition kids".
You are being very offensive to teachers and schools by implying this is a widespread problem with the education system in this country.