Why is Mumsnet so GC?

[ireallycantthinkofaname]

Maybe an odd question but I've never come across another space, online or otherwise, where being GC is the norm. IRL I only ever discuss GC views openly with one family member, whose stance on it is similar to my own, though, so I'm not saying it's unwelcome.... Just curious how/why it's come about. Any thoughts or theories?

👀👀👀 erm... Checks photo.... I believe so yes! Of course it takes a while for a pair to rotate to the front of the queue. I've not seen them in months!

I popped ny socks in for a quick wash and now half of them have disappeared.

If anyone finds an odd sock lying about anywhere, can you let me know?

Ta.

Mine all mine! Sits in pile of Emotional's socks! Sorry about the puddle of water I left on the kitchen floor, I couldn't find the mop after I'd pried the machine for open.

One sock ha ha ha
Two socks ha ha ha
Three socks .....

@Emotionalsupportviper i live in a house that seems to be full of single, abandoned socks. My children are obsessed with talking their socks off - but just leave them in weird places. Trying to find a pair of socks is a challenge.

As long as no one is one of DS (14)’s abandoned rugby socks (post game), it’s probably ok.

Everyone! Guard your socks, Beetle's stocking up.

Ahem! I'll see myself to the door.

Does BH really not grasp that the whole point of feminism is to argue that people don't have to behave in gendered ways because of their sex?

Women don't have to be womanly. We can play sports, get dirty, train as surgeons, disagree loudly, be obnoxious.

Men don't have to be manly. They can have sex with other men, show feelings, look after babies, grow their hair, refuse to fight in wars.

Feminism is the exact opposite of enforcing gender roles.

Feminism is the exact opposite of enforcing gender roles.

Indeed. Whereas "gender identity" relies entirely on supporting them. Without gender roles and gender expectations, they wouldn't be able to describe themselves.

TW - "I feel like a woman"

Sane person - "How?"

TW - "I like to wear dresses and tilt my head so I look 'cute' "

Sane person - <speechless>. 😶

@lordloveadog This is the bit I don’t understand either. Thinking that GC feminists want everyone to fit neatly into masculine and feminine boxes according to their sex suggests that people like BH have still not taken the time or effort to actually read and understand the GC position. It’s easier for them to put us in the box with right wingers and religious fundamentalists who want women to be decorative and mild and men to be strong and brave and all that shit.

Well, it's clear that BH and the dozens like BH before can tell women are women, when it comes to putting mumsnetters in the "clearly need a good bit of mansplaining" box

Did I say that?

You seem to be arguing with an imaginary person and then transposing that position onto me.

I was hammering bricks out of the wall of gender as a child long before Greer's disappointing anti-trans nose-dive!

What gives you the impression that a person who has spent her entire life defying and dismantling gendered strictures and expectations believes that people should behave in gendered ways based on the biology they were born with?

Why is there such a fixation on the ways that the polypeptide chains in our cells are arranged? It's so self-defeating.

Does BH really not grasp that the whole point of feminism is to argue that people don't have to behave in gendered ways because of their sex?

No. See: all BH's posts.

Good point, well made

Defeating perhaps for a minority who do not wish for biological facts.

Important to many women who prefer safeguarding, privacy, dignity and fairness

I will ask this again, it seems to get ignored whenever I post it, but maybe we will get some sense here.

Please can someone provide the evidence that the risk of male people with a trans identity, at any stage of transition, committing a sex offense is lower than the rest of the male UK population. Because 'gender' doesn't seem to have any fucking part in this material reality....

Which makes removing any 'gender' structures meaningless because the exact same safeguarding principles apply to all male people.

Either you haven't read The Female Eunuch or you are a lot older than I thought.

BH complains of suffering gender norm enforcement and seems to think GC feminists are in some way responsible.

But the feminist position is that someone male should be able to behave in as 'feminine' a manner as they please.

That's obviously not going to make them female. And we might think them silly and sexist. But we're hardly going to tell them to man up.

Ironically, women saying 'no that doesn't make you female' and being mansplained at by someone who's evidently very angry at women is very much in line with gender norms.

Why is there such a fixation on the ways that the polypeptide chains in our cells are arranged? It's so self-defeating.

In plain language, whilst men continue to dominate, abuse and rape, women are going to care who is a man and who is not a man.

The balls are - figuratively and literally - in men's court.

yeah. I don't think that Germaine ever thought that any male should be considered female despite how that male presented.

Dressing as a female and calling yourself a female doing stuff doesn't mean that anyone was ' hammering bricks out of the wall of gender'.

That seems like a remarkably misogynistic and entirely narcissistic thing to say. It is again more of this ego journey of being some kind of ground breaker. Why am I not surprised.

Yeah. Imagine if a male person started a campaign about truly broadening the bandwidth to make all males, however they presented, welcomed into the male single sex spaces.

That would be remarkable.

Dressing as a female and calling yourself a female doing stuff doesn't mean that anyone was ' hammering bricks out of the wall of gender'.

Quite. If BH had worn dresses and make up and behaved in ‘ladylike’ ways, but still acknowledged being male, that would have been properly progressive. Doing ‘lady stuff’ and then insisting that it makes you an actual woman is regressive as fuck.

Why is there such a fixation on the ways that the polypeptide chains in our cells are arranged? It's so self-defeating.

I've never heard any mention of polypeptide chains on this board before (I'd have noticed, I'm professionally very interested in protein structures but it's got bugger all to do with feminism.)

Perhaps you meant nucleic acid chains, as a roundabout way of saying 'biological sex'?. If you don't understand why that is important to females in general and feminists in particular, you've not been listening to us.

I was warned it would upset me but I forced myself to finish it - even the transphobic bits - in my late teens. That's always been how I approach bigoted opinions I disagree with - I try to understand them and the thought process of the people who hold them.

Enjoyed it more than I expected actually!

Why is there such a fixation on the ways that the polypeptide chains in our cells are arranged?

Why are people so obsessed with how protons, neutrons and electrons are arranged? It’s all so pointless and self-defeating.

Because, you know, it makes no difference whether you’ve got Helium, Carbon or Magnesium - does it? Or what form of carbon you’ve got. It’s all just a petty obsession and you’re all so regressive focusing on the vastly different properties of materials based on this tedious stuff.

except that the properties and behaviour of these materials do matter when they upset you and that means all the medical, surgical and social means to rectify things or create some semblance of having done so is all important.

Because consistency is never strong in this shite.

This.