Did anyone watch Doctor Who?

[ZeldaFighter]

So on an existential level, I'm confused. 11 Doctors and only 1 woman - it seemed like finally progress had been made. Now we're back to male people playing the role of the teenage daughter (who is explicitly transgender, so I suppose is really OK but now women can't even play the women).

Irl, I'm embarrassed because my husband immediately realised the actor was a transgender woman, whereas I didn't twig at all 😞

Did that jawline not tip you off?!

This was one of the Who-Queerings that irked me beyond belief. There are/were Time Lords & Time Ladies - & no switchy-swappy between the two. Obviously the first Doctor’s original companion, his granddaughter, Susan, was a Time Lady; but the 4th Doctor also had a Time Lady companion: Romana[dvoratrelundar]. While with the Doctor Romana regenerated once: the characters are referred to as Romana I & Romana II.

Making the Master “Missy” was just… creepy & disturbing. Blatantly someone’s weird wish fulfilment to have some kind of flirty situation going on; & it could only be done in a quasi-heteronormative context. They’ve known each other since childhood & have an insanely complex relationship with some pretty deep moral questions attached: “oooh, maybe they fancy each other” is so adolescent; but apparently that’s the level the writers are operating on.

The writers/producers (etc) would do well to heed the 3rd Doctor’s sage advice from attached GIF, subbing their profession for “politician” as necessary.

I realised straight away. Obvious man is obvious.

I wasn't going to contribute to this thread until I read Jo Bartosch's article in Unherd. Sorry, if it's been posted already

https://unherd.com/thepost/why-is-doctor-who-obsessing-over-pronouns/

I stopped watching during Jodie Whittaker's tenure and stopped paying attention during Peter Capaldi's. Does anyone know if the Tom Baker quote at the end of the article is the actor or the actor's Doctor? I'm betting....the Doctor? No plans to start watching again.

I'm sorry but I've never been a fan of David Tennant. To me he always comes across as very pleased with himself.

That sure was one beast of a manly jawline.

🤣🤣

Does anyone know if the Tom Baker quote at the end of the article is the actor or the actor's Doctor? I'm betting....the Doctor?

You win that bet. The quote continues something like: 'And that is rather uncomfortable if you are one of the facts in need of altering'.

Thanks @IcakethereforeIam will have a read of that.

I thought bits of it were good but almost all the acting was off, which makes me think the problem was actually the script. I think they probably tried to do too much and were so focused on the messaging that it became quite clumsy.

I enjoyed it. My fangirl self can engage with it at the level in which it was intended even as my better self is rolling my eyes at the triteness of RTD's gender-political analysis. His heart is in the right place, it's his observations, critical thinking, empathy and historic perspective that's a bit out of whack. Oh, and his ability to envision women as fully realised humans of course - age old Madonna/Whore, or rather Handmaid/Bitch, complex with that one I think! Still, he does make smiley shiny TV though!

I was surprised that The Meep made a pronoun crack, then realised it was probably going to be the baddy. That's the problem with letting your politics write your scripts, the plots get very predictable.

In fact, the thing that actually did jar through my somewhat-willing suspension of GC analysis for the purposes of light entertainment was the utter - well, frankly colonialism - of expecting everyone in the universe to comply with human's rules and ettiquette for preferred pronouns. I mean, most species in Dr Who (while usually being default TV male) have never really been explict about how they reproduce - and suddenly they are all in need of labels for whether they align to humanity's concepts of man and woman?

Agree.

Pronouns are a very human concept.

Heartstopper

This is the quote I alluded to in my pp.

As Tom Baker, arguably the best Doctor Who, once said, “You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don’t alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views.”

Very apposite. Jo Bartosch writes a good article. I wish they'd let her have a crack at Doctor Who 😀

Thanks! He’s a she IRL. Actress.

I wasn't far off. Full quote:

"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. They don't alter their views to fit the facts. They alter the facts to fit the views. Which can be uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that needs altering." The Face of Evil, which was series 14 ep.4.

I think you mean they are male.

I thought the script was shit and felt sorry for the actors. Best bit was when Donna got her memory back and started ranting at the Doctor about giving away the money then they sorted the problem. I quite liked the Meep insisting on the definite article, was a bit of a joke at the Doctor. An answer I'm tempted to use myself if asked for my pronouns.

As far as Yasmin Finney goes, she's good in Heartstopper (where she also plays a TW) and probably suffered the most from the shit script (as the newest character). I was looking forward to seeing her in the show and was sadly disappointed.

Who's a she? The male actor playing Rose?

Needs repeating!

There were 2 key things that were off about the episode for me:

1. According to their own timeline, “Rose” is supposed to be 15;
2. As I said on the Telly Addicts thread, I object to the portrayal of an almost passing transwoman/girl. The suggestion is that the transition is recent (talk about Donna and her mum forgetting not to say “he”), so we’re supposed to believe that this beautiful transition has been pulled off over a matter of months. It feeds into the lie fed to vulnerable children, particularly boys, that passing is easy and everyone will believe you’re really female. It glosses over the fact that the actor transitioned years ago, used cross sex hormones, possibly has had feminising surgery and has the full weight of a make up, wardrobe and lighting department behind him to ensure that he looked as convincing as possible. I had never heard of Yasmin before so googled, from the images I saw Yasmin does not pass half as convincingly in real life.

I don’t object to a trans character per se, I object to the portrayal that trans characters all pass wonderfully and are magically speshul folk.

I haven't rated David Tennant's acting for a while now. I think he's started to believe his own hype. Never a good idea. And fgs learn a new accent 🤣

I haven't watched it yet but I will at some point. At least I'm forewarned thanks to this thread. Hopefully I won't be TOO irritated. I was looking forward to this. I loved Donna.

I'd always liked DT, early dr who, broadchurch etc, but his staunch anti female stance has really put me off.
The piss poor, glitter rainbow hammer shit show of a programme this was has completely put me off the BBC, am fed up with this virtue signalling twee bullshit "go along with our ridiculous self fancy or you're mean!!"

I always find it's the neck that's the giveaway, or more precisely, the head to neck ratio. Out of curiosity, I just did a quick Google and found this...
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S002192900700317X

Never mind the hips, the necks don't lie!

I thought the same about the trans character on Neighbours. Not only were we expected to believe that their transition was smooth and easy, and that they passed perfectly, we were also expected to believe that they would instantly get accepted by everyone, and would get the hot boy as a boyfriend.

The Doctors aren't 1000+ years old either...