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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

High Court to hear judicial review claim from nonbinary US citizen over UK gender recognition law

178 replies

IwantToRetire · 01/11/2023 00:57

A judicial review claim that argues the Government's failure to issue a nonbinary US citizen a Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC) breaches the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) is scheduled to be heard by the High Court on Wednesday (1 November).

Ryan Castellucci applied to be recognised as nonbinary through the Gender Recognition Act 2004 (GRA) in 2022 but is yet to have been issued a GRC.

The 2004 Act states that a person can apply for a GRC on the basis of having changed their gender under the law of an approved country or territory outside the UK.

Castellucci was born in California, which is on the approved list of territories, along with most US states.

They moved to the UK in 2019 and have sought to have their gender recognised through the 2004 Act, which does not include an explicit list of which genders can be accepted.

Castellucci believes that having a GRC which states their gender as nonbinary is the only way they can legally clarify their gender in this country.

However, the Minister for Women and Equalities argues that the GRA only permits applications for the grant of a GRC on a binary basis, namely male and female.

Castellucci argues that the Gender Recognition Panel (GRP) tasked with considering their application breached its statutory duty to issue a GRC in terms which record Castellucci's acquired gender as nonbinary.

More https://www.localgovernmentlawyer.co.uk/litigation-and-enforcement/400-litigation-news/55489-high-court-to-hear-judicial-review-claim-from-nonbinary-us-citizen-over-uk-gender-recognition-law

High Court to hear judicial review claim from nonbinary US citizen over UK gender recognition law

https://www.localgovernmentlawyer.co.uk/litigation-and-enforcement/400-litigation-news/55489-high-court-to-hear-judicial-review-claim-from-nonbinary-us-citizen-over-uk-gender-recognition-law

OP posts:
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OldCrone · 02/11/2023 13:45

nauticant · 02/11/2023 13:26

If you check the link OldCrone you'll see that passport isn't included in the list of documents that show the "affirmed gender" for the "overseas route" in obtaining a GRC. My guess would be that the UK is still trying to apply some criteria and there is an understanding that passports in many countries can have the "gender marker" changed simply by making a request for that to happen.

It does mention birth certificate though. And he's from California which allows him to put an "X" on his birth certificate.

The gov.uk page says:

You can only apply to be recognised as male or female. Non-binary genders are not legally recognised in the UK.

So what he seems to be trying to do is force the UK to legally recognise non-binary genders. Non-binary for him appears to be having a surgically created wound as well as keeping his fully-functioning penis, for reasons which have nothing to do with gender dysphoria.

catduckgoose · 02/11/2023 13:47

OldCrone · 02/11/2023 12:58

We know what sort of surgery he's had:

Eventually they underwent surgery to construct a new vagina while preserving their penis

#NotAFetish

I wonder how that works. If the surgeons don't get rid of the pole, where do they dig the hole?

ditalini · 02/11/2023 13:55

And once again, the failure to distinguish sex and gender drags the powers that be back to the courts.

Create speshul marriage and death certificates for the sensitive of gender, with the gender box to contain whatever the fuck you like (while maintaining accurate records in the background for the state to function), scrap the GRA since it'll be no-longer required*.

Ryan is another victim of "I speak the words and I change reality" syndrome, except his manifests itself as "the database makes reality".

(*No need for birth certificates to be changed since our gender friends insist that no-one ever needs to show their bc for anything).

Chersfrozenface · 02/11/2023 14:05

catduckgoose · 02/11/2023 13:47

I wonder how that works. If the surgeons don't get rid of the pole, where do they dig the hole?

It's called "penis preserving vaginoplasty" and it''s offered by some plastic surgeons.

If you Google it, be aware that there may well be images.

Datun · 02/11/2023 14:30

OldCrone · 02/11/2023 13:45

It does mention birth certificate though. And he's from California which allows him to put an "X" on his birth certificate.

The gov.uk page says:

You can only apply to be recognised as male or female. Non-binary genders are not legally recognised in the UK.

So what he seems to be trying to do is force the UK to legally recognise non-binary genders. Non-binary for him appears to be having a surgically created wound as well as keeping his fully-functioning penis, for reasons which have nothing to do with gender dysphoria.

Add to get GRC in this country, you need a diagnosis of gender dysphoria.

And although we know they're not worth the paper they're written on, he would at least prove that.

CriticalCondition · 02/11/2023 16:34

to create his perfect pick n mix genital arrangement.

Was I wrong to read this as prick and mix? Grin

IwantToRetire · 02/11/2023 17:30

Eventually they underwent surgery to construct a pseudo vagina while preserving their penis

Having had a bit of a grim day, this made me feel even more despondent - what sort of "health care" providers does this.

But the I read this:

Was I wrong to read this as prick and mix?

So now having a good giggle, but still wondering how long the very people we want to know are going to act in a sane way around health are colluding with this madness.

OP posts:
Signalbox · 02/11/2023 17:38

ArthurbellaScott · 02/11/2023 13:02

So he's likely to have a lot of extra health issues that the NHS are now going to be dealing with, due to surgery that he's ordered to create his perfect pick n mix genital arrangement.

It’s just incredible to me that the NHS are permitted to carry out cosmetic surgeries that have a high risk of compromising a person’s physical health. I wonder if there any other elective surgeries available on the NHS that are so potentially harmful to a person’s physical well-being?

Signalbox · 02/11/2023 17:39

Signalbox · 02/11/2023 17:38

It’s just incredible to me that the NHS are permitted to carry out cosmetic surgeries that have a high risk of compromising a person’s physical health. I wonder if there any other elective surgeries available on the NHS that are so potentially harmful to a person’s physical well-being?

Although presumably the NHS didn’t perform his original surgeries. Are non-binary surgeries available on the NHS?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 02/11/2023 18:51

I don't think so and hopefully they won't be any time soon.

SabrinaThwaite · 02/11/2023 23:18

CriticalCondition · 02/11/2023 16:34

to create his perfect pick n mix genital arrangement.

Was I wrong to read this as prick and mix? Grin

Or even prick and minx.

Chersfrozenface · 22/11/2023 13:15

Any update on this?

As a more general query, where can one find the outcomes of judicial reviews on line?

nauticant · 22/11/2023 13:27

For this particular case, for judicial reviews it's quite normal for more than 3 months to pass from the hearing in court to when the judgment is handed down.

Chersfrozenface · 22/11/2023 13:28

@nauticant ta very much.

nauticant · 22/11/2023 13:55

Some decisions can come out rather speedily. The gender-related ones so far seem to be not on the speedy side.

Rightsraptor · 17/01/2024 19:31

Good news!

Rightsraptor · 17/01/2024 19:33

It's behind a paywall but I expect the DT will cover it soon so I'll read it there.

I think I wrote before when this thread was active about the cheek of a foreigner trying to change our laws. He should keep his sticky beak out.

Boiledbeetle · 17/01/2024 19:34

Excellent news!

However, in a ruling on Wednesday, Lady Justice Elisabeth Laing and Mrs Justice Heather Williams dismissed Castellucci’s legal challenge against Kemi Badenoch, Minister for Women and Equalities and the Gender Recognition Panel (GRP).
They said: “We have decided that whenever the Gender Recognition Act refers to ‘gender’ it refers to a binary concept – that is, to male, or to female gender.
“The GRP accordingly, had and has no power to issue a gender recognition certificate to the claimant which says that they are ‘non-binary’.”
The judgement, by Lady Justice Elisabeth Laing and Mrs Justice Heather Williams, was handed down remotely on Wednesday.

IcakethereforeIam · 17/01/2024 19:36

@Rightsraptor the archive link should, hopefully, bypass the paywall.

EasternStandard · 17/01/2024 19:36

How would non binary work in practise?

Entry wherever?

Although that’s kind of what we have now anyway

RethinkingLife · 17/01/2024 19:38

Thank you for the alternate link.

I'm relieved. However, if/when Scotland devolves, given their desire to be the most friendly country for NBs (if I understand the Non-Binary Equality Action Plan correctly), I should think RC might succeed there albeit it wouldn't count outside the devolved nation other than similarly minded countries.

NecessaryScene · 17/01/2024 19:42

From the article:

Last November, the High Court in London heard the UK recognises changes of legal gender that have taken place in several foreign countries and states – including California.

Although that is going to be or has already been rescinded for California, right? They're withdrawing recognition from self-ID states that no longer have a similar process to UK GRCs?

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