Y______? Principles

Dokeydonkey · 2023-10-25T21:05:25+00:00

Could anyone fill in the blank for me? I remember reading about a set of principles which are used when defending the choice to not use pronouns. I’ve tried googling on the site and I can not find them- I’m sure they begin with Y. Does anyone know what I am on about or have I finally lost it?!!

pickledandpuzzled · 25/10/2023 22:06

Yogyakarta

Original poster

Dokeydonkey · 25/10/2023 22:09

Oh thank you! I feel like I’ve just had the internet equivalent of an itch scratched! I never would have got that! Not in a million years! Thanks

OP posts:

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/10/2023 23:53

It's a city in Java, Indonesia where there was a meeting.

Crankywiddershins · 26/10/2023 06:49

Darn! I was hoping for a thread with a million witty suggestions and a bit of cheese humour for the derail. But this is all I get!
I'm going back to bed.

Datun · 26/10/2023 08:29

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/10/2023 23:53

It's a city in Java, Indonesia where there was a meeting.

Yes. It sounds all very official but I've heard it described as a bunch of transactivists on a jolly coming up with a wish list

NotBadConsidering · 26/10/2023 08:42

The Yogyakarta Principles aren’t useful to defend not using people self-declared pronouns, as I understand, there’s nothing in there about that (happy to be corrected.)

But they are useful to defend against the idea of people being made to declare their own pronouns, because principle 6F states it’s transphobic to make someone out themselves.

Its worth remembering though that they don’t have any authority and we’re rejected by the UN. As Datun says, it was just a jolly and has no more weight that a bunch of people down the pub trying to fix things after a few pints. Far too much legitimacy is given to trans organisations/policies. Like WPATH: held up as some bastion of authority. They’re not. It’s just an advocacy/lobby group of one particular view point. Whenever people bring up WPATH as a voice of authority my answer is “oh, you mean the organisation that collaborated with child sex abuse fetishists on a chapter about being a eunuch?”

AlisonDonut · 26/10/2023 08:42

It was a gay rights meeting that was hijacked by TRAs. It wasn't set up as a TRA meeting.

I mean, the clues were there right at the start!

Datun · 26/10/2023 08:52

NotBadConsidering · 26/10/2023 08:42

The Yogyakarta Principles aren’t useful to defend not using people self-declared pronouns, as I understand, there’s nothing in there about that (happy to be corrected.)

But they are useful to defend against the idea of people being made to declare their own pronouns, because principle 6F states it’s transphobic to make someone out themselves.

Its worth remembering though that they don’t have any authority and we’re rejected by the UN. As Datun says, it was just a jolly and has no more weight that a bunch of people down the pub trying to fix things after a few pints. Far too much legitimacy is given to trans organisations/policies. Like WPATH: held up as some bastion of authority. They’re not. It’s just an advocacy/lobby group of one particular view point. Whenever people bring up WPATH as a voice of authority my answer is “oh, you mean the organisation that collaborated with child sex abuse fetishists on a chapter about being a eunuch?”

Something that I'd forgotten is that WPATH was originally The Harry Benjamin Foundation. An endocrinologist who Helen Joyce calls an out and out quack.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 26/10/2023 09:10

Darn! I was hoping for a thread with a million witty suggestions and a bit of cheese humour for the derail. But this is all I get!
I'm going back to bed.

Brie kind @Crankywiddershins

Crankywiddershins · 26/10/2023 17:07

@Ereshkigalangcleg
I Gouda feeling we're Stilton the conversation.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 26/10/2023 17:16

I Camembert it

JanesLittleGirl · 26/10/2023 17:25

Cheese jokes? You're making me go Yarg!

Ereshkigalangcleg · 26/10/2023 17:40

Better than talking about feta-shism

<I'm sorry>