The dreaded issue arose with my son…

[HeadAgainstWall0923]

Today my 9 year old son told me that boys can change to girls, and girls can change to boys, and they can choose whether to be a boy or a girl whenever they want.

When I asked him where he’d heard that he said he’d been told it at school.

I feel so disheartened.

Those older children may well have been taught it. Dc have had a lot on gender at their schools

I’d say it’s easier to combat when it’s not a teacher as that authority lends trust

We cannot change sex and that should be a priority learning

What happens?

Changing your legal sex is something that is indeed legal but changing your actual sex is not something that ever happens, in any country, because it's not scientifically possible.

Allowing people to change their legal sex has caused huge problems for women's rights and child safeguarding in every country where it is legal.

Pointing this out is not transphobia.

Perhaps you live in one of the countries where people have lost their collective minds and think anyone who doesn't believe humans can change sex is an evil bigot and pat themselves on the back for being so progressive and kind, whilst ignoring the vulnerable women being unable to access single sex rape crisis support, or being raped and assaultsd in prison by male sex offenders who identify as female.

The fact that people in the UK have still got some semblance of a grip on reality and are resisting this does not make them in any way transphobic.

🙄I don't really believe in thumping the table and declaring one side of an argument to be lies, doesn't get you anywhere and your child will very soon stop seeing you as an authority because you take a 'you must believe this' approach when they ask you things.

If a 7 year old can understand the difference between gender and sex, then great! OP can have a really specific discussion with her 9 year old in that case.

But implicit in your discussion is also the conversation about whether they should go along with someone else's idea about themselves - even if it runs contrary to what the child knows and can see with their own eyes.

If you suggest to a child they should use pronouns and so on, " to be kind" what do you think that is teaching them about their own perceptions and what they know to be true. Is you child supposed to centre someone else's feelings all of the time?

A child of a similar age ( 10) in my granddaughter's school came back after lockdown declaring she was now a boy. She called her friends transphobic when they misgendered her. This upset and confused them. This girl was expecting different and special treatment; was having it suggested that her feelings come above everyone else's.

Meh, I was raised catholic and I'd still get my children to address a priest as Father and a nun as Sister - as a sign of basic respect

But isn't that also suggesting to the seven year old that they must have a gender identity too?

My eldest is 6 so this hasn't come up to date. I guess if it came to that, I'd say to follow whatever approach the school took.

I am keen to see how you and others explain to a child how a person 'lives as a different gender'? Is it just that they 'look like' the other gender?

This is the issue here. And yes, point taken that this was not a teacher saying this, but knowledge gained from 'peers' is just as much as an issue.

I echo those posters who suggest this should be treated as if it is a belief that someone has and that it should be respected as much as anyone with that belief. And yes, mention it is a legal fiction. However, this whole narrative around 'lives as a different gender', I am very keen to see this explained in any way that does not revolve around being similar to a belief system.

Because it is logic fail because there is no material definition of 'gender' and it seems to always revolve around 'gender stereotypes' when we are constantly assured that it is not gender stereotypes at all.

But implicit in your discussion is also the conversation about whether they should go along with someone else's idea about themselves - even if it runs contrary to what the child knows and can see with their own eyes.

I remember the thread about the dad who took his daughters swimming, only to find out later that the girls were hiding in toilets to avoid a male person using the womens changing rooms and they didn't want to see his penis.

They were already conditioned to hide and keep quiet about being flashed and intimidated by a male person because they should go along with someone else's idea of themselves instead of keeping themselves safe. That is where all of these ideas of someone changing gender leads us.

That's nice for you. I don't though, as I don't think the Catholic church deserves my respect.
Maybe you should teach your children that respect is earned, not demanded.

Of course the OP doesn't want anyone to tell her child that sex change is a thing that exists; it isn't.

Yes, it's legal to change your gender. The problem is that gender isn't actually real, and by allowing adults to change their gender we are pretending that gender is a real thing and that society should be organised around it.

That is because they are a 'sister' or a 'father'.

What you are doing when you expect a child to use pronouns which are in contrast to the reality of the child's sex- is you are sowing unnecessary confusion - and nurturing a tendency for them to not take their own feelings and knowledege of truth seriously - or to gloss over it for the sake of 'being kind' to others. Which is what youy are actually doing yourself by embracing gender theory.

When the children go on to secondary and this supposed 'girl' goes through puberty and gets to be 6ft at 14 years old - are you expecting the girls in the class to have him play in their team sports and use their toilet facilities?

Or will you be suggesting puberty blockers?

Surely there are some things, like the fact that humans can't change sex, which should be taught to children as the truth. Or do you think that children should be taught all sorts of crackpot theories and leave them to make their own minds up about whether those or the actual science are right?

Living as a man/woman: pronouns used, name chosen, how the person choose to present themselves physically (e.g clothes, hair, style etc.)

I’ve explained a couple of times how gender and sex and can be discussed with a child in the context of transgender people.

@fearfuloffluff and would you be happy letting that priest watch you get changed in the gym changing room? Or sharing a prison cell with them.

I won't accept that any male has a right to take away my decision that no male will see me or my daughter naked without our explicit consent. Even if that male wears a pretty dress and tells me their name is Susan.

There are conflicts in the rights of women and the rights of trans identified people. The reason that there are conflicts is because people cannot change sex. It is an impossibility, it cannot happen. If you are born female, you die female, if you are born male, you die male. What you wear, how you present, what you call yourself is all window dressing.

I wouldn't! I'd be down at the school demanding to know what exactly was being taught.

What do you understand as the difference between gender and sex? Because you seem to be using them quite interchangeably in your posts.

You are not helping them by omitting biological facts

No one in this thread has said that you can change biological sex. What you can do (and very few people choose to do) is live with a different gender identity to the one you were born with, and be legally recognised as that gender.

Do you realise the current law on gender reassignment was written to allow gay men who had undergone surgery and 'full' transition to legally marry their partner - before the advent of same sex marriage.

Great he's raised this with you at 9. It means you can fully prime him before secondary school. Good luck.

But the ability to change sex isn’t something that can or cannot be believed. It is not down to someone’s individual choice as to whether it can happen or not.

Changing sex is impossible. It absolutely cannot happen. That’s a truth, not something one can choose or not choose to believe.

Its like teaching them about the heart but then saying it’s up to them whether they want to believe it is the heart that pumps the blood around the body or not. And if your child then says, “Actually mom, I think it’s the stomach that pumps the blood around the body,” - do you just let them believe that or do you correct them?

It’s complete nonsense.

Scientific fact and biology IS the truth - it’s not something people can either choose to agree with or not.

But implicit in that is the belief in the concept of 'gender identity' in the first place.

You don't need to thump tables and declarre anything. But is IS lies, whether you say so or not.
It does get you somewhere, it gets you facts. Your child will not see you as an authority because you take a truth and a lie and tell them they are both opinions. They'll think you an idiot.
Do you tell them that some people think the earth is flat and some don't and both opinions are ok? Do you tell them that some people believe the Holocaust happened and some don't, and we should respect both sides and not thump tables on one side or another?

Of course you don't. So why are you doing it with something equally as truth vs lie?

Parent properly.