New sports club at DC’s high school only open to LGBTQ+ pupils and their allies

[SirChenjins]

Are they legally allowed to exclude GC pupils? Or pupils who are not one of the special alphabet children?

This is a really great club - nothing like the school has offered before. Seems a shame to limit attendance based on sexuality/gender ideology rather than interest/ability.

We’re in Scotland if that makes a difference.

OP has explained that's the only club.

I agree to an extent @MarshyMcMarshFace - the school already has a lunchtime group for these pupils to meet. It’s the fact that this is a sports club which is excluding pupils unless they leave their GC or neutral beliefs at the door which is wrong imo - that they must specifically ally themselves to an ideology to gain entry.

We’ve all seen multiple examples of women being denied spaces to meet without male born TWs, it appears to be very one sided at the moment.

I see what you mean. Any possibly of asking for this activity to be included in the other clubs; could it be pointed out that if it's only in the one club that excludes certain groups (or puts pupils in a position of needing to lie to access this activity) then it is unfair, and if also provided elsewhere then that maintains the integrity of the excluding group as pupils will not need to lie to attend, so they can be assured that all who do attend truly meet the inclusion criteria

This is wrong.

I think it's absolutely fine to have a sports club for, let's say, gender diverse children who don't want to be in biological sex categories.

If it's a sport that is usually played in single sex teams but these children don't feel comfortable with that then by all means have a third option. But you don't even have to call it LGBTQ+, just call it mixed and tell the children that they can either join the team for their birth sex or the mixed team. That would be so much better as well for any gender questioning children who didn't feel comfortable playing in a single sex team for their birth sex but aren't ready to come out, because they and their friends could just say they prefer a mixed sex environment.

It's doubly wrong if there isn't an equivalent team or club for children who don't fall into this bizarre category. And it's clearly deliberate because if any child asks for another club the response they'll get is, "Why? Aren't you an ally?"

Of course if you really wanted to troll them you could call up the school and say, "Sasha really wants to play this sport but she doesn't feel safe playing mixed sex sports. Is there any chance you could have a club for AFAB LGBTQ+ children and their allies and a club for AMAB LGBTQ+ children and their allies?"

"This is a club for Christians, Muslims Hindus, and any other religions, and atheists that are supportive of any religions.

Except Jews, they can't come."

This will be one of the most under represented groups in sport. They will have very limited opportunities to play sport in an environment that they feel safe in. It (imo) is a good thing.

Absolutely @SummerDayz47 - if they wish to start their own group so be it. Being an ally is irrelevant from a discriminatory pov though.
I take it you’re also in favour of women and girls (who are likewise underrepresented and underfunded in sports) being allowed to feel safe in their changing rooms, not losing their places on teams to men, not losing their records to men and not being prevented from having single sex groups?

GC types: trans people should set up their own third spaces!

trans people set up their own third spaces

GC types: you can’t do that! It’s exclusionary and discriminatory!

special slow handclap for ‘special alphabet people’.

JFC.

If this was a third space for the gay, lesbian and trans ideology believers then excellent, go for it.

It’s not though.

JFC right back at you.

*Gay and lesbian pupils

The class will be run by a member of staff doing it voluntarily in their own time because they’ve identified a need to get particular students who are underrepresented in sports to participate, and offer them the opportunity to bring a friend for support if that’s what it takes to encourage them to participate. Am GC but can’t get twisted about a group of underrepresented young people being encouraged.

If DS really wants to participate then he can think of himself as an ally in being supportive of getting this group of his peers who don’t currently engage in sport, interested in sport. Unless he’s determined to be a troublemaker and raise his views on gender at every opportunity then, if asked, “I’ve joined because I really want to try out waterpolo and I think it’s great that people who identify as LGBTQ+ who don’t always feel comfortable about showing their bodies have the opportunity to play waterpolo in this supportive group” is a perfectly fine response - and presumably true. We’d all ideally like everyone who feels uncomfortable to have a space where they can feel comfortable, regardless of our politics.

Or, you could volunteer to help run another group for the sport, as whoever runs this group is doing.

It's not a third space, it's the only space for this sport.

From the OP, it sounds like it's being done at a state school (?) presumably using public money. And there isn't anything like it for other pupils.

I wouldn't call that a "third space".

What do you think about trans-activists harassing someone for trying to set up a female only support group?

How are they checking who is and isn't an ally?

Could your child just go along anyway? The staff might be glad of the extra person because I can't imagine how many actual LGBTQ+ and allies there are, who happen to want to do the sport at that particular time.

Seems very strange to me that the group is aimed at a particular group on the grounds of sexual orientation. Yes this is high school (and yes many teens are sexually active) but are these children beyond the age of consent in your region? Seems like children are being unnecessarily sexualised in the name of inclusivity, at and age where they may still be trying to figure out who they are and what they are attracted to. I think this is a big faux pas on behalf of the school.

Do you know who they actually mean by ‘Allies’?
Do they mean the participants can bring a friend along to help them feel comfortable or do they actually mean people who believe in a particular ideology?

You could try sending school this:

https://www.transgendertrend.com/school-lgbt-club/

An ally is anyone not trans or homophobic really so they’re not excluding anyone.

This

it is interesting that there is a current thread talking about a poster trying to set up a female only rape and sexual assault meeting but activists are doing exactly what dancingbear has posted

@SirChenjins I missed the fact that you have a son rather than a daughter, which does change the balance of how this affects him personally, in my opinion.

Is it a sport where boys have a physical advantage over girls, or is it something like bouldering where it really doesn't make any difference and mixed sex participation is common?

If there is no real need for it to be single sex, then if you could be arsed to write to the school I'd say something like, "I was quite surprised to see this new sports group labelled in such a way. Whilst I applaud efforts to help the LGBTQ+ community feel safe and welcome at school, I wonder whether labelling a specific mixed sex sports group as being for LGBTQ+ children and their allies might give the impression that other clubs are not inclusive of this group, which would be a shame. It might also create a barrier to joining for any student who is privately questioning their gender identity but does not want any other students to know yet, which I believe would be the opposite effect to what was intended. Would it not be better to simply label this a mixed sex sports group, which is what it is, and aim to foster an environment where all students, regardless of their sexuality, sex, gender, race, beliefs, disabilities or lack thereof feel safe, included and welcome everywhere in school, and that all the other students are their allies in relation to whatever struggles they may be facing? For other sports where students typically play in single sex teams for reasons of safety and fairness, it would be really positive to have an additional mixed sex team for those students who want one, again without any specific reference to LGBTQ+ students or their allies. That way a child who does not feel comfortable participating in sport with members of their own birth sex can choose to participate in a mixed sex group without needing to label or out themselves, but equally, children who are transgender or non binary but wish to compete with members of their birth sex should be free to do so in the knowledge that these spaces are also inclusive and welcoming, regardless of their gender identity."

Miyagi99

do you know what their definition of ‘ally’ is then?

Spot on but it's Scotland so no doubt the actual intention of the law is being deliberately disrespected. Orwellian.

Transphobia and homophobia should not be tolerated in any of the school clubs, and labelling one specific club as being safe for LGBTQ+ students suggests that the others are not. Why not just label it mixed sex?

From the Equality Act 2010 schedule 16:

"An association does not contravene section 101(1) by restricting membership to persons who share a protected characteristic."

Do LGBTQIA+Allied students share a single protected characteristic? If not, it is potentially unlawful to exclude other students on the grounds of belief, which is also a protected characteristic.