National Trust AGM

[PRAMtran]

I’ve received an email from the National Trust inviting me and all other members to vote in their AGM. Does anyone know if there are any things a woman’s rights advocate should vote for or against. Eg TWAW by stealth.

This thread was about “the other issue” but got diverted.

The contested topic is the overall saturation in, and pushing of social justice theories/activism - which all come from a similar stable of postmodernistic ideas and thinking: Intersectionalism ( which has now declined into " Listen to my truth" " and "stop with micro-aggressions"); Critical Race theory and Queer Theory.

I don’t think reporting them was unjustified, to be fair. Hoover’s description of them was accurate.

Better the posts are deleted than the entire thread.

Fair enough!

The contested topic is the overall saturation in, and pushing of social justice theories/activism - which all come from a similar stable of postmodernistic ideas and thinking:Intersectionalism ( which has now declined into " Listen to my truth" " and "stop with micro-aggressions"); Critical Race theory and Queer Theory.

you are entirely and utterly incorrect in your assertion that I have accepted all of the above without question.

I am very sorry and I now agree with everything that Datum Tarum, GOT and Hoover say. I would like to see much more information about slavery in every National Trust property. In fact there is no amount that I would consider to be too much.

I hope this apology will be taken in the good faith it was intended. I prostrate myself at the feet of DEI departments everywhere and will self flagellate every hour on the hour from this point onwards to cleanse myself of impure thoughts.

Well I did enjoy reading through this thread although a lot of it was waaaay over my head.

I am a NT volunteer at a country house, not grand but still bigger than your average residence. I volunteer there because I spend time (without paying 😉) in a beautiful place and can meet lots of interesting people who are a) not all middle class b) not all stupid and c) not all there just for the tea and cake.

We know that our place has no obvious/promotable connections to slavery, black lives, LGB or queer stuff (caveat: afaik). We did have a housemaid who went on to be a suffragette, but we don't big her up too much either. There is clear evidence that the domestic, garden and agricultural staff were valued and looked after.

Our visitors hear our stories and either listen or move on. In my years of working there I've not been challenged on the slavery issue or BLM and the word Queer has never been used in 'that' way (also afaik). My fellow volunteers may have slightly different outlooks/experiences but we tend to agree that we choose to volunteer in our place because we love it the way it is, and by and large our visitors do too (they also like cake and having a good time, nothing wrong with that).

I do agree with some PPs that improved visitor information would be helpful, but not of the 'making-a-point indoctrination' kind. If this was thrust on us we would stick it in the bin (metaphorically speaking and possibly literally also). Our young rainbow-lanyard NT staff probably know this, as they work well with us and value what we add. They know that good volunteers in rural areas are hard to find/replace nowadays.

The only nitpicking I've got with the NT is the gender field on the volunteer surveys, which I refuse to fill in, and I avoid where I can that DEI stuff which they do because everyone does.

So PPs advocating interpretation to forcibly educate the masses - be prepared to step into the volunteer vacancies.

@SerotinaPickeler interesting contribution. So the ‘forcible education of the masses’ piece has happened but RT, the Government and a few right wing news outlets are campaigning for it to be reversed.

Appreciative of the fact that yours is not one of the 93 properties with a link to slavery, it would be interesting to know whether or not there has indeed been a mass exodus of volunteers.

if not it would seem that this concept of ‘forcible education of the masses’ is, by and large, nothing more than an assumption based upon a knee-jerk reaction to a wider set of ideological theories to which some people are vehemently opposed.

This thread is getting better and better! Cotton tapestries, gender neutral toilets in private homes, and anybody who criticises a particular interpretation of history just ‘doesn’t like history’

DB (civil servant in the Ministry of Justice) used to say that the reason the CPS were so useless was because they employed the third rate barristers who couldn't get work elsewhere. Perhaps the NT has the same problem with third rate historians and archaeologists (alleged).

The loss of volunteers is mostly down to covid (older/vulnerable didn't return) and the lack of new volunteers such as students (too busy doing paid work to survive) and working age people (ditto) and those put off by the cost/ hassle of travelling to often rural locations. So we are mostly retired from paid work, if not from life.

My knee will probably jerk in response to anything that I am not comfortable with - a natural reaction, yes? That does not make me vehemently opposed, just 'not for me, thank you'.

I think you have got to the nub of the problem here. The majority do object to ideological theories being imposed.

Thank you for your informed contribution @SerotinaPickeler. I found it very interesting to hear your views and also thank you for being a volunteer. It’s so great to be able to visit these places and it couldn’t happen without you. I’ve read recently of visitors being so disappointed that rooms aren’t open because of lack of volunteers and even properties that have had to close for the day entirely.

The assertions,and insinuations, that people are being led by the nose by a " few right wing media outlets" is a well worn trope that 'm personally more than weary of; as were your insinuations on 'Feminsim Chat' that people who frequent FWR are not really liberals at all.

In spite of the protestations to the contrary you are falling into the same well worn grooves of those who do subscribe to CSJ theories and activism.

I was a little surprised by your referencing 93 properties being linked to slavery. The NT report also covers links to colonialism so perhaps that is the combined figure?

a " few right wing media outlets" is a well worn trope that 'm personally more than weary of
No, it’s evidenced by a news article I posted to upthread. Would you like me to post it again?

No-one has managed to demonstrate why they feel the National Trust is operating under either a political agenda or is enforcing an ideology. But this has been blindly accepted without question.

At a basic level this is about utilising a clear and obvious avenue to remind people that great wealth is often associated with very dark places. Something which at one point was indeed purposefully kept out of the natural curriculum. if anyone can show to me
why it’s more sinister than that I’ll gladly take a look but all I am seeing is anti-woke rhetoric and recycled anti-gender ideology arguments.

@narniabusiness nit-picking of the highest order but yes.

It’s the ideology bits that are offensive

@PRAMtran please provide more details

Nit picking of the highest order? I’m just trying to get a more detailed understanding of the impact of Slavery in respect to the NT and asked a perfectly reasonable question.

At a basic level this is about utilising a clear and obvious avenue to remind people that great wealth is often associated with very dark places. Something which at one point was indeed purposefully kept out of the natural curriculum

Why was it kept out of the national curriculum and by who and for what purpose? people on here have said they learned about slavery at school.
Frankly, if you don't know that great wealth is often associated with very dark places you've been walking around with your ears and eyes closed. Look at Russian oligarchs, for a start.

Something which at one point was indeed purposefully kept out of the natural curriculum

And what evidence do you have for asserting this?

Frankly, if you don't know that great wealth is often associated with very dark places you've been walking around with your ears and eyes closed. Look at Russian oligarchs, for a start.

what about children? Because you are a great frequenter of museums and other aspects of culture and media it is a little rich to feel you are able to dictate that others should get their history from other places.

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk-politics/2020/06/history-british-empire-not-taught-schools-curriculum

what about children? Because you are a great frequenter of museums and other aspects of culture and media it is a little rich to feel you are able to dictate that others should get their history from other places

If you'd care to tell me why you think I feel able to dictate that and where these other places are I think people should go then I'm all ears.

And what about children? 🤔

So one article is your evidence?