Page 22 | National Trust AGM

PRAMtran · 2023-09-04T12:59:37+00:00

I’ve received an email from the National Trust inviting me and all other members to vote in their AGM. Does anyone know if there are any things a woman’s rights advocate should vote for or against. Eg TWAW by stealth.

PencilsInSpace · 08/09/2023 23:21

TheHoover · 08/09/2023 23:07

ok, that’s pretty clear. my line of work is heavily involved in initiatives to improve inequitable outcomes in healthcare. I have successfully been involved in obtaining funding for carers in specific scenarios, improving translation services, clinical research trials, targeted outreach programmes, prevention and early detection of major illness campaigns in communities that don’t talk about their health and a few more.
Leaving these things to improve organically would mean nothings changes and differential outcomes prevail.

How can the National Trust help with this?

Rudderneck · 08/09/2023 23:29

TheHoover · 08/09/2023 21:34

@RebelliousCow

do you believe that all progressive diversity and inclusion initiatives are simply the work of critical social justice theory? Do you see
any threshold between positive change and awareness raising and divisive ideological identity-politics?

Actually do you fundamentally believe the NT is wrong in raising awareness with visitors where the estates they are visiting were founded on the wealth obtained by slavery and mercantile colonialism?

Some on this thread dont seem
to have a problem with this as long as it is not shoehorned or domineering. Others freely admit to wanting their weekend outings not to be spoilt by horrible history. And the final few are much more concerned with the ideological motivations of the NT and those who approve of what they have done rather than the crux of the argument itself.

There is nothing wrong with wanting to visit a beautiful place just to enjoy it, which was a major goal of preserving these properties in the first place. So everyone who wanted to could enjoy them, not just the wealthy elite.

I studies history, mainly of the ancient world, in my degree, and I am quite aware of the things that went on. The human heart is capable of many evils.

But a lot of weekends, when I am off work, when I sit down to read something, you know, it's not a book about the horrors of history. It's maybe a sci-fi novel, or I might head to the theater and watch The Equalizer III, and put a little money in Denzel Washington's pocket.

It doesn't make me a better person if I only read books or watch films with a heavy moral message, nor am I a worse person if I go to an old house or garden and just enjoy it as a thing in itself.

TheHoover · 08/09/2023 23:33

@RebelliousCow some astronomical sweeping judgements and character assassinations there! Woweee. Plus a huge glaring amount of hypocrisy.

i am not sure where you draw your own line between what is acceptable
DEI and what is CSJT but you are obviously aware that I am countering the suggestion made by you that initiatives are bad and progress should be organic.

There is a body of data being gathered that is isolating a combined morbidity increase predictor based upon certain communities staying away from hospitals due to a fear of ‘white person’s medicine’. It is startling. But, like other complex issues like childhood morbidity it requires a huge amount of engagement to get to the heart of what is causing this and try to make our services and communities and general society feel more welcoming. Not sure whether this is ok or CSJT nonsense?

TheHoover · 08/09/2023 23:49

iGermany as a nation freely acknowledges the sins of their ancestors during the holocaust. There isn’t any hint of ‘everyone already knows this stuff’.
Is this just wokery? Boring and tiresome?

Germany Is Often Praised for Facing Up to Its Nazi Past. But Even There, the Memory of the Holocaust Is Still Up for Debate

Questions about confronting the Nazi past have been settled in Germany's history textbooks, but still cause controversy in villages and towns

https://time.com/5772360/german-holocaust-memory/

PencilsInSpace · 08/09/2023 23:50

PRAMtran · 08/09/2023 20:15

Actually I started this thread not wanting to vote for TRAs

Reminder of what this thread was supposed to be about.

LoobiJee · 08/09/2023 23:50

Going back to the original topic of this thread…..

Was it @BernardBlacksMolluscs who said they were going to go through the list of 39 candidates?

If so, have you managed to do that yet?

Sorry, if I’ve misremembered but I couldn’t face ploughing through multiple pages of repetition to try and find the relevant post.

Clymene · 08/09/2023 23:59

TheHoover · 08/09/2023 23:49

iGermany as a nation freely acknowledges the sins of their ancestors during the holocaust. There isn’t any hint of ‘everyone already knows this stuff’.
Is this just wokery? Boring and tiresome?

Woah. Yoi went there.

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 07:53

Rightsraptor · 08/09/2023 21:14

Has anyone formulated Critical Gardening Theory yet?

Once the weather turns, as it inevitably will, I may have a go at it myself for a winter project.

This looks right up your alley.

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:09

Clymene · 08/09/2023 23:59

Woah. Yoi went there.

Show quote history

And it’s quite reasonable to “go there”.

We’ve been discussing (along with more frivolous topics) how we represent the history of 3.1 men, women and children who were captured and forcibly shipped to another part of the world. 400,000 died on the voyage. Many women were raped. Many slaves died from overwork and starvation.

And on this thread we have people who:

Want more ‘humour’ in the discussion of this brutality.

Want to censure perfectly legitimate mentions of connections between NT properties and this trade.

Essentially because they are scared of some phenomenon that they can’t provide a single example of.

All so they can enjoy a scone without any challenging thoughts.

Original poster

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:15

What is wrong with a nice day out looking at attractive objects. I don’t want gender neutral facilities and and a queer theory history.

OP posts:

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:20

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:15

What is wrong with a nice day out looking at attractive objects. I don’t want gender neutral facilities and and a queer theory history.

Nothing. But NT properties have always had information concerning the history of the house, who built it and their background.

And yet, several people on this thread want to leave out any perfectly legitimate mention that the source of the families wealth of it was connected with slavery and colonialism.

Do you want that? If so, why?

You scan still have your untroubled day out - just don’t read the info boards if you’re not interested in history

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:21

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:15

What is wrong with a nice day out looking at attractive objects. I don’t want gender neutral facilities and and a queer theory history.

You do realise you have a gender neutral toilet in your own home.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 08:22

You do realise you have a gender neutral toilet in your own home.

Oh love do you open yours to all comers?

Original poster

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:24

I thought they’d given up with the home gender neutral toilet, it’s soo silly

OP posts:

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 08:28

It's good that @GodessOfThunder is so generous in her provision of toilet facilities, for anyone caught short in the street. I hope they don't leave it less than pristine.

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:30

Nothing more to add about the NT I guess?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 08:31

Not at the moment, when you made such a silly comment.

Original poster

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:31

It shows how vacuous and ill thought out all the other stuff on this thread is. And It’s all there for a single purpose, to disrupt and queer. I had no idea about all this when I started this thread, it’s certainly been an education. I still haven’t looked at that Restore Trust website but I really think I must now.

OP posts:

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:32

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:31

It shows how vacuous and ill thought out all the other stuff on this thread is. And It’s all there for a single purpose, to disrupt and queer. I had no idea about all this when I started this thread, it’s certainly been an education. I still haven’t looked at that Restore Trust website but I really think I must now.

example?

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:33

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 08:31

Not at the moment, when you made such a silly comment.

No worries. The argument was won several pages ago - and not by you

Original poster

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:33

Pretty much everything you and your queer history friends have written. Any hoo I’m going to ponder my votes

OP posts:

Original poster

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:34

Restore Trust You say

OP posts:

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 08:35

It shows how vacuous and ill thought out all the other stuff on this thread is. And It’s all there for a single purpose, to disrupt and queer. I had no idea about all this when I started this thread, it’s certainly been an education.

I found it useful reading up on queer theory from a radical feminist perspective. It probably isn't everyone's cup of tea but Sheila Jeffreys' "Unpacking Queer Politics" is good, it really helped me understand.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 08:35

The argument was won several pages ago - and not by you

you are funny

ArabeIIaScott · 09/09/2023 08:36

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:33

No worries. The argument was won several pages ago - and not by you

Show quote history

Well, I've been reading along and I would suggest Eresh won hands down.

If we're going to reduce discussion to a childish, petty, point scoring game.