University gym "womxn only sessions"

[adulthumanfemalemum]

Went into local uni sports centre today. Posters everywhere advertising their special gym sessions only for "womxn and non-binary." Lots of blah about how important it is for "womxn" to feel comfortable using the gym. At the bottom in small print an explanation that "womxn is an inclusive term which includes people previously excluded from white feminist discourse, such as women of colour and trans women." FFS. So it's okay to use the word woman to describe trans women but not to describe actual women. And these special sessions are in fact open to anyone who says they are non-binary or a woman. So not remotely a safe single sex space. I'm so cross. I was there with 15 year old DD who is super woke with lots of trans and non binary friends. I really wanted to talk to her about it but didn't want to spoil a rare activity together by arguing.

Totally agree, Zodfa. Most people respect boundaries. If they don't, it's a red flag for me.

There was a thread about this a while ago
Started with latinx which apparently is said latinex
So I guess womxn is womexn or womexen

Just hurriedly sent this email to the director of sport.

Have screen shotted it in editing mode, as it has my name in it.

Hope it helps

When I was pregnant I attended the women's swimming sessions. I was the only white woman there, of course. The women were so welcoming when they saw my bump. I just can't imagine them feeling comfortable in a womxn session!

Future changing room scenario---

"Look mum, that's man's got his willy out!"

"Oh dear, let me see....oh he's wearing a wig, that's fine"

"He's wearing a wig? But I don't want to see that!"

"Yes, dear, men can't get their willies out in front of women and children, but if they're wearing a wig, then they're allowed. We are okay to see those willies. Remember, willy at the bottom, wig at the top, yes yes. Willy at the bottom, bald on top...no no no, bad willy."

Absolutely. Hence the poster who remarked that she'd feel more comfortable in a genuine 'Mixed' session (open to men and women) than a 'womxn-only' session.

🤦‍♀️

What kind of ‚opportunities‘ are we talking about in regard to single sex spaces?

The thing about "womxn" is that organisations trying to pander to trans rights activists have been burned using it before, and told that it's "terf speak"

https://twitter.com/andreiaoo_nobre/status/1366815029610352642?s=46&t=SPorwN-mokktL467rcZ57g

And again closing down of another woman's opinion. I repeatedly used the word I. And yes I don't like segregation in any form you can like or dislike what you wish ...

Sussex Uni - famous for being misogynistic and captured.

Kent Uni - (three years late to every trend) 'hold my beer'

Honestly, no point in complaining. The uni and especially the students' union are in thrall to Stonewall and have been stupidly slow to realise the tide is turning. They'll get it eventually but it needs a change in leadership and a return to critical thinking first.

Questioning what you are saying is not 'closing down another woman's opinion', that's a ridiculous get out for taking responsibility for what you said.

You cannot have it both ways.

Either you didn't understand that by saying you are behind there being no single sex facilities you are excluding women, particularly vulnerable and minority women without the privilege you have of not minding, or you do understand what you are saying but don't have the courage to admit you do agree with exclusion for those women.

Which is it?

As for 'segregation' -

you can permit women to have facilities segregated from men, and have some accessible provisions for everyone.

or you can permit those who have the privilege to be able to use mixed sex facilities to segregate themselves from those who don't. And leave those people without anything.

Which do you think is better?

I got a reply from Canterbury university. Basically they said that they’ve had other emails highlighting that the non-binary term “is an area of exploitation by some” and they are looking into trying to address this, but have also had a lot of positive feedback about the idea.

Notice the times don't include early mornings, none at weekends, and none for anyone who works a 9-5 job in practice.

but have also had a lot of positive feedback about the idea.
...from men who now have the opportunity to go to all the classes...?

What utter bollocks. I would be asking when the women only sessions were. And how even more insulting to lump in women of colour with trans women (men). Twats.

Then you should be arguing for fully open spaces, no special groups. If you're anti segregation you should be anti groups which in practice exclude most men and a hefty percentage of women for no good reason.

Are organisations obliged to share their Equality Impact assessments? Would a FoI request for the Equality impact assessment be worth doing? (To check if they gave a thought to e.g. Muslim women)

My friend works at the uni. He said he can lose his job if he talks about it. They've got security on the door to 'check'.

That’s awful for your friend. What do they mean by security/checking? I’d love to know how the people behind that would answer “but what is there to check if literally anyone can go in” - presumably they have a little clipboard and will ask “do you identify as a womxn” <slow clap>

Check what? ' I see you're a white woman. I'm afraid you can't go in as all the Black and minority women, and all the non-binary people, might feel threatened by you because of the history of white women being evil bitches.'

But giving everyone the same oportunities isn't the same as treating everyone the same.

The pools in my are have various sessions, women only, lane swimming, 'sheltered swim', over 50s, SEND family swims, tots swimming.

They probably have different sessions now it is school holidays.

That's inclusion. Or at least a decent stab at it.

its funny how whenever there’s a thread about changing rooms or toilets there’s always a bunch of posters demanding “how would you know they’re a man/woman?” as if it’s incredibly difficult to tell the sexes apart, but when it’s involving non binary or trans womxn suddenly there’s no confusion.

Suddenly sex exists when you need to define yourself against it. Or when a baby is desired. No confusion then as to who to ask to rent a uterus for 9 months from..

I'd go to men's sessions, tbh

they do have a point about groups of women being missing from historical and other feminist discourse though.

Are they offering any bio-women-only courses for some of those women? Muslim women for eg? Orthodox Jewish women?