Transwomen in Professional Darts

[Heliotroper]

Van Leuven knows that not everybody appreciates her “big glow-up”, as she puts it. Or the fact that she will be the first trans woman to play in a televised Professional Darts Corporation (PDC) tournament. Nevertheless, she wants to speak. “Because,” she says, “now I have the opportunity to tell my story. And not let other people tell it.”

The rules as they now stand are unequivocal: trans women are eligible to play in women’s tournaments as long as their passports say they are female, they have been in hormone replacement therapy for over 12 months and their testosterone level is below a certain mark. This is, of course, exactly as it should be. Physical strength, body development, player safety: none of these are remotely an issue in a game where all you really need is a functioning arm and decent eyesight.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/jul/14/noa-lynn-van-leuven-darts-interview

https://dartsnews.com/pdc/interview-noa-lynn-van-leuven-becomes-first-trans-woman-at-televised-tournament-at-pdc-its-hard-to-do-top-sport-in-such-a-position

We can’t have anything 🤷🏼‍♀️

"The beauty of darts lies in its openness. The players arriving in Blackpool for the World Matchplay – 32 in the main event and the eight who will compete for the women’s trophy next Sunday – have come from all over the world in pursuit of ambition, glory, a career-defining cheque. But they all share a single origin story. You don’t need a set of clubs or a mountain of expensive kit. You don’t need to find a team who will take you on. All you need is three darts. In the purest sense, this is a sport for everyone."

Ok, now go to any pub in the country and look who dominates the darts board

And the rules may be unequivocal but who wrote them? Any women involved? Were women in the game canvassed for their opinions?

It's evident that darts has single sex competitions but why? Presumably women can be as good as men so why is the sport not mixed sex in the first place?

I thought Victoria Monaghan was the first ?

I vaguely recall (probably from a
sports podcast!) that there is a bunch of massively sexually dimorphic traits that impact anything throwing related - doubt that any of the blokes who run international darts give a shit though!

This might be the study I remember being discussed but I don’t have the brain power to read it properly this morning (need caffeine and reading spectacles first!)

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnhum.2019.00231/full

I thought darts was mixed sex but it just goes to show that even when it’s not, certain people have to muscle in for their validations anyway.

Bugger off back to the men’s, mate. Whatever the ins and outs of physical advantages, you’re still taking up a space that was meant for a woman.

Don't men and women stand different distances from the board? Which would imply there's more to it than 'anyone can chuck a pointy thing'.

Wonder what the reaction of a drunken chanting crowd will be ?

They may even start quoting a song or two

No

So why is there a separate women's tournament at all? Because men's and women's bodies are different? Because men, on average, are taller and therefore have greater wingspan than women? Because men have more upper body strength?

Does testosterone suppression and a lie on your passport make a man suddenly give men the same wingspan and strenth as a woman? Does it make him a woman? Does it fuck! I wish they would all just fottfsof!

They can't. Men have significantly better hand to eye coordination and throwing accuracy at elite level.

Not at major competition level, apparently!

Apparently, keeping trans women out of women's sport is incredibly misogynistic, because it suggests that men are stronger than women. And if you cite any differences in muscle mass, biomechanics, reach etc, you just hate women. This is an argument I've seen a lot recently, from my acquaintances in sport.

If that's the case, surely we shouldn't segregate by sex at all?

But then, how would these blokes get to feel validated?

Darts run open and women's I thought

In womens Women stand closer as they tend to be shorter

It's very rare for a woman to make it on the open circuit but it does happen

Ah a fluff piece written by Jonathan ‘would it be that terrible if women didnt win anything ever again anyway’ liew

I suspect The Guardian will be having a lot of these sort of articles over the coming weeks

the best women in the world - Greaves, sharrock, Suzuki- do play in the men’s tournaments. Often by invitation rather than qualification - they rarely make it through the qualifying rounds and only sharrock has ever made a final. So even in darts where you’d think sex shouldn’t make a difference - it does. Still as long as Noa feels validated eh

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/athletics/caster-semenya-news-gender-martina-navratilova-trans-cas-jonathan-liew-column-a8792861.html

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2022/jun/28/nadine-dorries-offers-the-illusion-of-easy-choices-while-trans-athletes-pay-the-price

Jonathan Liew has a lot of form here

My spell checker wants to call him Jonathan Lies!

Curiously the winner of the women's tour qualifies for the men's tour and that place could go to a biological male

Disgusting. I'm fed up of these cheats. I'm also fed up of all the stupid weedling arguments around testosterone and strength, ignoring the fact that there are other reasons like menstruation which could mean that a woman might not be able to practise everyday like a man could.

Currently there are eight spots on the women's tour.

I would have thought any serious journalist investigating this subject would find opinions among those currently trying to get into those spots

Why would this be? I fully understand about average heights, and muscle mass, and skeletal structure, but "inferior hand eye coordination" feels one step away from saying that women can't fly fighter jets etc.

'The best of myself'🙄
What fucking bollocks.

The only reason the PDC has women-only events is to provide the opportunities and development that female players have historically been denied.

Even Jonathan knows the reason

The problem is that he does not know what a female is

Whatever Noa Lynn's passport says, whatever Noa Lynn's testosterone levels, whatever Noa Lynn wears, whatever hormones Noa Lynn takes, what ever surgery Noa Lynn has, what ever bloody pronouns Noa Lynn wants people to use , that I have decided to ignore, Noa Lynn is not a female.

As a bicep has more fast twitch muscles and a recent study apparently showed (I have not been able to access it read it myself) that males had more fast twitch muscles in their bodies, would fast twitch muscles be responsible for accurate aim?

Along with the combination of strength in the arm, grip strength and height? And breathing, males have longer between breathes so have more time to aim.

Would that combination make a difference ?

It's a good question. I recall some research about sex differences in spatial reasoning / awareness - but separating this out from nature or nurture is tricky. The impact of playing games like football etc from a young age may well have an impact?