Men in the Ladies

[Manichean]

I thought this was a very apposite piece of discourse on the subject:
https://www.facebook.com/reel/569687092017163

And I think he's totally missing the point.

I suppose he's making the obvious point that women aren't safe from ill intentioned men in the ladies just because it says 'ladies' outside. Which was taken to a new level today for me at an outdoor event that I attended where the ladies had a special section with urinals in it...

The joke doesn't work if the intention of man wishing to enter the women's public toilet is exhibitionism or voyueurism or some forms of sexual harassment.

Both are much easier (and less risky) if the person wanting to engage in them doesn't have to worry about anyone questioning him being in that space to begin with.

In any case, a total berserker bent on killing people (women in this example) wouldn't be stopped by anything as silly as laws making homicide a crime, for instance, either, or locked doors, or even police presence.

But we do have laws doing that, just as we have implicit contracts about which sex is supposed to use women's toilets and changing rooms etc.

Off topic but I always cringe a bit when comedians do that half-laughing at their own joke thing. You can see he practised it in front of his bathroom mirror and thought "pause for laughter here, this bits hilarious".
The only exception is Ricky Gervais who gets away with it because the cringeyness is a deliberate part of his comedy persona. Also he's funny.
Actually maybe this guy has modelled himself on Gervais which just adds another layer of cringe.

Right. What about the 'transwoman' (cross dresser in old money) who was in the ladies' toilet masturbating when I came out of the loo. I was seventeen. He was definitely deliberately transgressing to use the ladies' toilet in order to include women/girls like myself in his paraphilia. Is that apposite enough for you?

cor, that was not funny. did you genuinely think it was?

low standards @Manichean , low standards

It isn't about toilets - it's about sports teams, changing rooms, leadership training, lesbian bars, hospital wards, locked mental health wards, domestic violence refuges and prisons.

If toilets is all it is, he might have a point.

Exactly. Men & their "bitz n ballz" have no place in any womens spaces.

Not funny at all.

It reminds me of how totally unfunny The Onion is now, ranting incoherently about how evil Jk Rowling is without the slightest trace of wit or humour.

Someone needs to explain the Hippocratic oath of comedy to this chap:

first, be funny

if you’re doing ‘first be aligned with current left wing received opinions’ then the only people laughing at your stuff are pretending, in the manner of English teachers laughing at a Shakespeare comedy

Can’t get past the fb cookies message unfortunately, but what I’ll say on this subject is that until the last few years I’d never seen out and out blokes in the ladies. I.e. what some might term cis men. Yes, yes, I know I don’t know this is what they are, but obviously at the same time I absolutely do know. I have seen this a few times now, including a man with his female partner and their child and a guy who made very deliberate eye contact with me. The first came across as entitled, the latter was clearly taking the piss in a ‘come on, what are you gonna do about it?’ way.

Common denominator is that the boundaries have been broken down since we all know that if you challenge you’ll get some smart aleck bollocks about possibly maybe being trans. Men’s spaces are now single sex and then we have the open category for anyone who fancies it.

Agree, not funny, misses the point entirely, and is a joke made by a man who would never EVER be threatened by this behaviour. One of the key breakthroughs of alternative comedy in the 1980s was that it was about mocking the powerful. This is the powerful punching down. Not impressed.

I found it funny.

I don't agree with him of course, but I still found it funny. The idea that women can escape any kind of threat by just hiding in the toilets is frankly, ludicrous. Any determined man wouldn't be stopped from entering - the 'ladies' sign isn't some kind of impenetrable force field.

The joke kind of reminds me of the Mrs Doubtfire scene when Robin Williams keeps swapping personas/outfits and gets mixed up as he gets more drunk. Sally Field laughs and says, "You're going into the men's room", and he says oh yes, I need new glasses. Wouldn't happen now, people daren't make a comment about where they feel more 'comfortable'.

The part of the joke he conveniently missed out is that now no one can even question why a man is entering the ladies' loos. I saw it once with a very drunk man in a pub. I genuinely think/thought he was just confused and a bit lost looking for the men's, but swaying outside the ladies', peering at the sign. I just said, oh, the men's is that way.

He turned and yelled at me FUCK OFF I IDENTIFY AS A WOMAN and stumbled in.

Beardy woke bro misses point entirely shock 🙄

no one is stupid enough to think it was ladies signs that kept men out if they were determined to rape & murder women

We had a social contract that said “ladies toilets are for women only” therefore any man going in would automatically be flagged as transgressing social boundaries and asked to leave. The social contract was around safety yes but also dignity & privacy as well

now thanks to the terminally hard of thinking like mr wokey wanker here, that social contract has been ripped up. Now men can quite happily go into women’s spaces by announcing they identify as a woman. Toilets, changing rooms, support groups, the WI, women’s sports, programmes to increase female politicians all wide open to men thanks to mr beardy and his ilk who will never be affected by it and are apparently incapable of reasoning beyond A to B

Ah yes, those stupid women who go into the ladies loo in an effort to get away from a threatening man are sooo funny

heeeelarious

yuk yuk yuk

no one is stupid enough to think it was ladies signs that kept men out if they were determined to rape & murder women

We had a social contract that said “ladies toilets are for women only” therefore any man going in would automatically be flagged as transgressing social boundaries and asked to leave. The social contract was around safety yes but also dignity & privacy as well

now thanks to the terminally hard of thinking like mr wokey wanker here, that social contract has been ripped up. Now men can quite happily go into women’s spaces by announcing they identify as a woman. Toilets, changing rooms, support groups, the WI, women’s sports, programmes to increase female politicians all wide open to men thanks to mr beardy and his ilk who will never be affected by it and are apparently incapable of reasoning beyond A to B

This.

Anyone who thinks it's funny to describe a vulnerable and frightened woman trying to get away from a predatory male and having no chance or options for safety, isn't funny.

Imagine finding that so funny you can't get the joke out.

Emphasising that women basically have no where to go in the face of male violence isn't funny.

I just can't get the obvious stupidity of completely ignoring the fact that if women feel unable and disempowered to challenge men in women's spaces then the social contract is lost and we are all mor vulnerable for it.

The joke seems to be ‘men will assault women wherever they feel like it, and women who have any expectation of safety or privacy from men are stupid’

<jazz hands>

cue much hilarity

Yep.

It's slightly depressing how some shittily unfunny bloke can stand there and say openly he finds women's worries, fears, and well founded reasons to be cautious about males fucking hilarious, and get applause for it.