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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Musk tweets Suzanne Moore's comment piece: "The cult of gender ideology is finally disintegrating"

120 replies

ResisterRex · 10/06/2023 07:07

He's not @'d her but he's tweeted her comment piece in the Telegraph from last week:

twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1667297563719122945?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

Underneath, he's added an archived link and a comment, saying: "It is worth noting that kids who are same-sex attracted and/or autistic are the most vulnerable".

As he's has a lot of followers (140M or so), this means a lot more chance of the issues reaching a lot more people.

Previously this kind of thing would have risked being taken down on Twitter, so it's maybe a sign that #nodebate is gone/going.

OP posts:
FlirtsWithRhinos · 10/06/2023 12:09

Summerhillsquare · 10/06/2023 09:53

He's no friend to feminists.

True, but neither are TRAs. And at least he's not actively promoting the medicalisation of people who don't fit gender stereotypes, or actively agitating to undefine female people as a political or social group.

Florissant · 10/06/2023 12:12

NotHavingIt · 10/06/2023 10:13

He's asperger's and so doesn't adhere to the same sorts of social codes, that's all. He says what he thinks.

Yes. We tend to do that, which offends NTs.

Igmum · 10/06/2023 13:49

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pickledandpuzzled · 10/06/2023 13:53

hyperspacebug · 10/06/2023 11:23

Elon Musk has son who has legally changed name to of a female name. Sad background to this.

https://www.scotsman.com/news/people/elon-musks-child-vivian-comes-out-as-trans-and-seeks-to-sever-ties-with-her-father-3742331

That is sad. So he knows whereof he speaks.

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 13:57

Lordy don’t these journalists realise that if the only newspapers that will have them are right wing then they might just selling their souls for one area of opinion.

SunnyEgg · 10/06/2023 14:00

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 13:57

Lordy don’t these journalists realise that if the only newspapers that will have them are right wing then they might just selling their souls for one area of opinion.

Why don’t the left wing media run with GC opinions as it’s basic biological reality after all, nothing to lie about

Is it because they are too in hock to gender ideology?

OldCrone · 10/06/2023 14:20

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 13:57

Lordy don’t these journalists realise that if the only newspapers that will have them are right wing then they might just selling their souls for one area of opinion.

Suzanne Moore had been writing for the Guardian for about 30 years before she finally left for the Telegraph because the Guardian was effectively silencing her. No idea what you mean by 'selling their souls'. She just wanted to be able to write about issues that she felt were important.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 14:21

SunnyEgg · 10/06/2023 14:00

Why don’t the left wing media run with GC opinions as it’s basic biological reality after all, nothing to lie about

Is it because they are too in hock to gender ideology?

Personally, I think Hadley F and Suzanne Moore have gone too far with some of their pieces to be accommodated in middle ground, liberal or left wing press. An example would be the interview where Hadley Freeman was mean about Margaret Atwood.

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 14:23

OldCrone · 10/06/2023 14:20

Suzanne Moore had been writing for the Guardian for about 30 years before she finally left for the Telegraph because the Guardian was effectively silencing her. No idea what you mean by 'selling their souls'. She just wanted to be able to write about issues that she felt were important.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/

But it’s the Telegraph, which is almost the The Daily Mail or Express

pickledandpuzzled · 10/06/2023 14:25

In what way was she mean? People can be pretty mean while still being published.

Clarkson springs to mind.

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 14:28

pickledandpuzzled · 10/06/2023 14:25

In what way was she mean? People can be pretty mean while still being published.

Clarkson springs to mind.

It’s an embarrassing piece and well out of order. They printed it but got a lot of complaints

SunnyEgg · 10/06/2023 14:32

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 14:21

Personally, I think Hadley F and Suzanne Moore have gone too far with some of their pieces to be accommodated in middle ground, liberal or left wing press. An example would be the interview where Hadley Freeman was mean about Margaret Atwood.

Could you link an example of a decent stab on this issue, in your view, in the left wing press?

ResisterRex · 10/06/2023 14:35

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IncomingTraffic · 10/06/2023 14:38

Summerhillsquare · 10/06/2023 09:53

He's no friend to feminists.

The whole purity politics thing is just unhelpful.

The fact that there is a vague (and it is vague) merging towards something like consensus from all kinds of people
and groups that gender ideology and trans activism may be a problem is only indicative that it’s a problem.

It doesn’t mean all the people troubled by this agree with each other about anything much else.

Being all weird about radical feminists, Elon musk, right wing surrendered wives and who know who else all not being on board with the contemporary TRA agenda only benefits the TRAs.

after all, the same kind of broad societal consensus also exists in relation to flat earth theories and many, many other things. All it indicates is that the theory/ideology/aim is widely viewed as problematic. Nothing beyond that.

Let’s stop giving in to the TRAs’ attempt to discredit any opposition by association and point out that most people, when they actually give any thought at all to what gender identity ideology is saying or what TRAs want to achieve, are not ok with this.

SidewaysOtter · 10/06/2023 14:41

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 13:57

Lordy don’t these journalists realise that if the only newspapers that will have them are right wing then they might just selling their souls for one area of opinion.

I don’t buy this idea that anything right wing is terrible and unacceptable, and I say that as a lefty. It’s a fucking mainstream newspaper that’s right of centre, not the Nazi Weekly.

OriginalUsername2 · 10/06/2023 14:48

Thank you Elon 🙏

And Suzanne Moore 🙏

And Matt Walsh 🙏

FrancescaContini · 10/06/2023 14:52

Great article by Suzanne, as always.

What SG did to her son is beyond sickening. I’m surprised she’s not in prison.

GailBlancheViola · 10/06/2023 14:54

An example would be the interview where Hadley Freeman was mean about Margaret Atwood.

Mean about how? What did she say?

It's a lot more than mean for your co-workers to bully you out of your job as happened to Suzanne Moore a the Guardian merely because she didn't agree with them.

unwashedanddazed · 10/06/2023 14:55

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 14:28

It’s an embarrassing piece and well out of order. They printed it but got a lot of complaints

https://www.theguardian.com/books/ng-interactive/2022/feb/19/margaret-atwood-on-feminism-culture-wars

This interview? Mean? Embarrassing? I think Freeman was extraordinarily respectful and kind. Asking someone about views they have expressed publicly is not 'mean' (such a childish perspective).

Margaret Atwood on feminism, culture wars and speaking her mind: ‘I’m very willing to listen, but not to be scammed’

At 82, the Canadian author has seen it all - and her novels predicted most of it. Just don’t presume you know what she thinks

https://www.theguardian.com/books/ng-interactive/2022/feb/19/margaret-atwood-on-feminism-culture-wars

FrancescaContini · 10/06/2023 15:00

mastertomsmum · 10/06/2023 14:21

Personally, I think Hadley F and Suzanne Moore have gone too far with some of their pieces to be accommodated in middle ground, liberal or left wing press. An example would be the interview where Hadley Freeman was mean about Margaret Atwood.

“Mean”?! This is playground talk.

GailBlancheViola · 10/06/2023 15:00

SidewaysOtter · 10/06/2023 14:41

I don’t buy this idea that anything right wing is terrible and unacceptable, and I say that as a lefty. It’s a fucking mainstream newspaper that’s right of centre, not the Nazi Weekly.

I agree with you @SidewaysOtter if anything the Guardian and their authoritarian attitude are the ones showing complete intolerance and the ones demanding you sell your soul to the ideology and politics they promote if you wish to work there/write for them. The supposed 'right wing' press seem more than capable to host people whose political allegiance is at complete odds with theirs without combusting.

FrancescaContini · 10/06/2023 15:03

OldCrone · 10/06/2023 14:20

Suzanne Moore had been writing for the Guardian for about 30 years before she finally left for the Telegraph because the Guardian was effectively silencing her. No idea what you mean by 'selling their souls'. She just wanted to be able to write about issues that she felt were important.

https://unherd.com/2020/11/why-i-had-to-leave-the-guardian/

Thank you for pointing this out, @OldCrone
The Guardian treated SM very badly. She was one of their better writers, so it was their loss.

GailBlancheViola · 10/06/2023 15:14

Okay, thanks to @unwashedanddazed I've read the interview and see nothing remotely mean in it, although for some so steeped in this ideology anything and everything is mean or worse.

Macaboom · 10/06/2023 15:18

It is worth noting that kids who are same-sex attracted and/or autistic are the most vulnerable

He tweeted this under the article, good for him I am glad he's highlighting this.

IcakethereforeIam · 10/06/2023 15:22

'Mean' as in average? I think it was an excellent interview. I think Hadley does great interviews.