Why is it socially acceptable to stereotype and vilify white women as a whole?

[TheTERFnextDoor]

I've seen this a lot recently, often from other white women bizarrely, and I don't understand why it's socially acceptable?

I think it goes without saying that in most groups, you get good and bad people. White women are surely no different in that respect? Yes, many of them are privileged, and they don't face the discrimination that other categories might. I accept that. However, that doesn't change the fact that they aren't some homogeneous mass of people, surely?

I am genuinely trying to learn here, so I'd appreciate all responses, particularly those that disagree

The Special Place in Hell podcast where the two hosts, Meghan Daum and Sarah Haider, interviewed the Race to Dinner founders makes for interesting listening. Sarah Haider is a Pakistani-American woman who had different views on lumping everyone together and racial stereotyping to the Race to Dinner women. It was the liveliest podcast I’ve listened to in quite a while. It went off piste in an unexpected way. 😄

It's racism.

It’s all lazy

There are privileged white people, and privileged black people; there are extremely underprivileged white people and extremely underprivileged black people. I don’t think the white single mother using a food bank & worried that she’s going to lose her home has more power in our society than eg black MP’s or senior business leaders.

Of course there is racism and sexism, and ethnic minorities, and women are over-represented among our most socially and economically powerless groups.

Lumping lots of people together and saying their experience or behaviour is identical because of one or two characteristics is blatantly untrue

This, pretty much.
It's a reductio ad absurdum and it drives me mad.

I could write an essay about this, but it would be outing, so I won't.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2023/may/22/uber-suspends-diversity-chief-karen-bo-young-lee

Yup.
Publishing houses etc like to make money and at the end of the day no man (well hardly any) is likely to buy a book called "white men's tears" or "Why you are a dreadful dreadful person". Women on the other hand absolutely will (not all). Self reflection/self criticism isn't a bad thing in itself. Apparently women as a group are slightly less prone to cognitive bias than men and being able to examine your own prejudices blah blah is important. But there is a point when it becomes self indulgent and counterproductive. But if women will pay 2,500 a head to be told they are awful there will always be someone willing to take their money.

And of course, people that just enjoy vilifying women will take the opportunity presented.

Im sick of hearing and seeing the word privilege and sick of seeing things prefaced with 'white' this or that Its utterly lazy and I instantly switch off

Me too. There was an accusation of “white fragility” when someone I knew was bullied by someone else - the someone else wasn’t white, the bullying victim was. The instant assumption that the bully was in the right solely because of the colour of their skin and the victim was perpetuating “white fragility” for complaining of being bullied just made me give up on the whole thing.

Also, “Why I’m No Longer Talking To White People About Race”. Well if you’ve lumped me in with a whole bunch of other people solely because of the colour of my skin, I don’t want to hear what you have to say. If the boot was on the other foot and someone said “All black people [insert assumption here]” it would be wrong, so why is it OK to treat white people like that?

This is so true.

Have you read the book?

Have you read the book?

No, but I understand the premise of it from an article the author wrote in, I think, the Graun.

I used to think ignorance around this issue was intentional but I find myself increasingly wondering where that line is drawn.

It's for the same reason many seem to think it is ok to vilify white men. Either they are dicks and it makes them feel good, or it's a way to assert power over others.

Aren’t you doing exactly the same here though? Telling white women prejudice towards them isn’t racism?

Why do you think it’s ok for you to tell white women when they can be concerned about racism? Isn’t that a bit hypocritical when you’re complaining about people doing that to black women?

I think the word "privilege" is a disaster. I know it has a nice sophisticated meaning that makes sense when explained, but there are so many dirt-poor "white" people who are obviously going to misunderstand it and take offense. So, instead of lessening racial problems it is contributing to increasing them. And surely it is in everyone's interests to cut down of racial hatred.

I think some people want to “other” and silence white women by labeling them privileged Karens. This type of negative label is a way of shutting people down and not allowing them to express their opinions on essentially anything.

Of course some white women do behave badly and have racist beliefs, as do many other people.

Aah it's intersectional hatred.

From other white women above about 35: it's basically "pick me, I'm not like the other white women" directed at the people group they want to impress. Includes internalised racism and misogyny.

Young woman and men: it's ageism. Pure and simple.

From men: it's misogyny.

Other groups exist too!

From all of them and the others: it's an absolute (internalised) hatred of middle aged and older women. I believe there's some deep-rooted hatred of their mothers. Aside from the white women who call the police on black people in America, all other women labelled this that I've seen are middle aged women complaining about something. Often they've a point, although sometimes it's less obvious. What's noteworthy, is in this world of "Be Kind", there's NO empathy for the group of people who have - as a group - been the ones who've sacrificed for their children, who are often going through menopause-related difficulties, have often taken up the slack of the second adult in the house who did minimum housework and/or they were left to raise their children alone, who statistically 25% of whom have suffered sexual assault, and who were a generation basically brought up to Be Nice to the detriment of their wants and needs.

If you choose to recognise the suffering of some groups to explain their behaviour and not only ignore the suffering of another group, but take pleasure in vilifying them for their behaviours, then that's a manifestation of hatred.

A lot of you are missing the point.
Privilege is not saying easy life or without struggle but that people do not see that and judge you on it from the outside. Someone upthread mentioned white mum going to food banks vs wealthy black MP, well the black MP may well get the police called on them for knocking on a strangers door in a wealthy neighbourhood whilst the white poor mum would likely not.
I'm white and poor and I've managed to do some pretty dodgy stuff with no one really raising an eyebrow. I keep my food shopping in my own reusable bag before purchasing. Carried a full size replica axe around a busy city centre on a Friday night.
White women's tears unfortunately are a thing, especially in the legal world. Yes white women who commit crimes do get more lenient sentences than women of colour, more likely to get hospital orders etc.
It's the lack of wanting to learn that gets me. Why not try to learn about micro aggressions, systematic racism, privilege? Why is it a better use of your energy to get offended?

Why pick on women?

Prejudice towards white people isn’t racism. But yet again most people on this thread would rather get offended than actually do a bit of self reflection and consider when they may have been part of perpetrating structural and systemic racism. @crunchingupeyeballshohohoho seems like the only one who actually gets it.

There has been a development of a narrative that one is either an oppressor or the oppressed and those categories change dependent on the argument being made.

Thanks to Karl Marx whose ideas have killed more people than Oppenheimer’s nuclear bomb.

Because this is a thread about white women in the feminist section?

Prejudice towards white people isn’t racism

But it can be. Racism can operate at the individual or group level as well. It doesn’t have to be systemic or structural to be racism. It’s why and how we have hate crimes- to punish racism at the individual level.

Well said.