Young women are losing patience too

[FeodoraVictoria]

I am seeing more and more young women not afraid to say what they think about men claiming to be women.
https://youtube.com/shorts/LLDaI8TFpUY?feature=share

Sadly, I’m a GC teacher and the pupils I teach are still in full trans mode. My daughter is nearly 12 though and has never mentioned anything about gender or sexuality - maybe as I’m an ardent feminist and she has lesbian aunts with kids. To me it seems the kids questioning gender are gay but don’t want to admit it - why?

I'm so sad to read this @FrictionDiction
and hope it is not the case. I think Lesbians saw what was happening really early on but no one listened enough.

An interesting post. The reason for this seeming symmetry might be that all those groups have seen or experienced mistreatment for their membership in that group or, in the case of mothers, in how children are treated. How they define the problem, though, can't be explained very easily. As you note, the camps that have developed are almost diametrically opposed to each other.

There's also the far right (or perhaps a better word is the anti-feminists) which in almost everything is opposed to women's rights but in this particular example supports some of those rights.

This is not about the kind of symmetry your post discusses, but I find it fascinating to contemplate, how anti-feminists suddenly pretend to be feminists in some ways.

Maybe the best parable for it is that the far right and the gender identity ideologies are like feral dogs (or some other predator suitable for this parable) and foxes fighting over which group has the dominion over the chicken coops, and for both types it makes sense to pretend to stand with the chickens against the other group until the other group can be turned less powerful.

But then the gender identitarians are also very close to the anti-feminists in many of their beliefs about the value of maintaining sexist stereotypes and retrogressive gender roles (boys play football because that's what boys are wired to do, or if a girl plays football then she might be wired as a boy), but for opposite reasons. So they, too, can be seen as both aligned with and actively opposing each other.

@RudsyFarmer same here. My year 7 DS totally understands. He had older siblings, all sportspeople and GC. Never bumped on the Trans bus.

For the kids and teens, it's fad and fashion and will die out. But some of my peers (late 20s/early 30s) are so incredibly into the ideology, it's become part of their identity despite not having any skin in the game or knowing any trans people. It's bizzarre.

The UK is in Europe. I live on the continent and have visited many European countries. Unisex public toilets are very much not the norm.

This has probably been mentioned already, but just in case not, I'm pretty sure that song is Yoko Ono's.

And she's too right.

I’ve actually recently read some research on school age children ( secondary school age) who identify as trans and their mental health is far worse than other children’s and young people’s on every scale measured and they are far more likely to engage in risky health behaviour such as having sex earlier, unprotected sex, sharing explicit photos of themselves, drinking, smoking gambling, you name it, they measure most poorly at it. That research suggests they are not just whining- they actually have serious issues. I now think a child or young person who identifies as trans should immediately be flagged at school as a safeguarding/ child at concern risk.

Related to this my workplace has just updated its logo and we’re all having to redo our email signatures. I’m wondering (hoping…) if there’s going to be a decrease in the number of people including their pronouns in signatures as it’s going to be everyone making a conscious choice whether to include them or not. There’s no company policy and I think about 50% include them at present.

Darkernights · Today 07:40
turbonerd · Yesterday 14:58

^I think the kids will be over this, if not already because of the incessant whining.
They whine fucking all day long- and don’t Get me started on the fucking pronouns and «mis» gendering.^

Good grief. They are insufferable
I’ve actually recently read some research on school age children ( secondary school age) who identify as trans and their mental health is far worse than other children’s and young people’s on every scale measured and they are far more likely to engage in risky health behaviour such as having sex earlier, unprotected sex, sharing explicit photos of themselves, drinking, smoking gambling, you name it, they measure most poorly at it. That research suggests they are not just whining- they actually have serious issues. I now think a child or young person who identifies as trans should immediately be flagged at school as a safeguarding/ child at concern risk.

Where did you read that?

It isn’t an identity so much as a symptom.

Sorry- to be clear I was agreeing with you Darker.

Do you have any recommendations of books or anything on how you will approach this? My dc will be year 6 next year and I want to do this.

I do understand many of them do have issues that need adressing, but not all do.

Sadly, the ones in need of help are now lumped in with the whiners, and it is difficult to make the distinction so that the ones who truly do need help can have it.

I have been familiar with both, and it is very upsetting as it takes focus away from the ones suffering.

Talking about the younger teens in my post just above.

Same with young boys. I have 3 very different teen boys and, apart from the youngest who is in year 7 and is only just hearing about it, the older two just roll their eyes when anything about trans or rainbows is mentioned. I had an interesting conversation with my 18y old the other day as he was being a bit vitriolic about is and I said dontet it bother you too much just keep out of it and he said, yeah, but they're ruining everything. You can't even say anything about girls or sex without being cancelled, which I thought was interesting. Tide has definitely turned in secondary school that I see.

That wallpaper in the public toilet is horrible. Imagine having to walk your children past this!

That wallpaper 😱. What sort of agenda is at work there?

I’m going to treat it like I did when I discussed religion and ‘people’s beliefs’.

I shall be saying that I believe that science and truth is important when thinking about both subjects and how I believe that organised religion was a concept that was used to encourage people to behave in a way that benefitted society as a whole and was based on many civilisations that came before where they would worship gods and deities.

However as time went on Science explained many phenomenons that would amaze and confuse more primal people and that society changed and now there are many more atheists and people who are agnostic (myself). Similarly ….. and then I’ll talk about biology and those who believe we can change biology at will etc etc.

So im not going to really come at it as though the T belongs anywhere near the LB or G as I don’t think it’s a sexual preference. I think it’s more of a cult being profitised upon by big pharma and many autistic teenagers are getting dragged into it and losing their fertility to it.

No we bleeping won't .. and TW are biologically male.

Do not tar us all with the gender brush.

I’m not tarring anyone with anything. I just asked a question.

It is a good question @Signalbox and I have wondered that myself. One of them is currently single and I would eat my hat if she started dating a transbian.

You are probably right, but if it's done with thought, it might not be a bad thing.

Part of the reason that groups representing sexuality issues were vulnerable to this is that some elements of the political lobby and culture were not well thought out or poorly expressed. Many people who maybe realized that thought that it wasn't too important if it supported the main point, and anyway, no one would take it too far, right? Too much was tied to ideas like acceptance without exception, love is love, if you are born that way it must be ok, and so on.

It also became enmeshed with identity politics, which I think has probably been toxic to every area it has touched, and as a result it was too much associated with an often reactionary political progressivism. People who weren't politically progressive tended to stay away, partly because they didn't see their political views as very tied to their sexuality, so why be politically active mainly in that sphere? And similarly, especially with gay men, people who weren't on board with an everything goes attitude to sex tended to stay away.

As a result what was originally conceived as a rights movement for a very specific set of ideas became almost a political ideology that included quite a lot of elements, and anyone who wasn't on board with any of it being increasingly branded as homophobic.

It would not be a bad thing to distangle all of that and reject what was bad.

I've wondered as well. I know a few lesbians who take that approach - they tend to say they are queer and use they them pronouns, but they are clearly lesbians, some in long term relationships with other women, none have dated men as adults.

I would be very surprised if any dated a transwoman.

The only think I can think is they think of it as being like not wanting to date someone with big ears, or blonds, something accidental to their category.