Tickle vs Giggle

[KCOZ]

For those of who are aware of the Tickle vs Giggle court case in Australia, Sall Grover is looking for some gardening to be done to support her defence. The deplorable response of politicians and the press in Australia to the Let Women Speak rallies, only emphasises how important this case will be.

Just search Giggle crowd fund - she has set up her own site to avoid any potential censorship by the established sites

I find the quote that being female is getting death threats very telling.

State sanctioned bullying. I always say I won't get upset and then angry again, but I always do.

This period is like a crammer intensive course in misogyny, made worse as it's practiced by the #BeKind crowd.

There's nothing kind about what Sal is going thru.

https://www.bendigoadvertiser.com.au/story/8364549/sex-changeable-commission-backs-trans-womans-case/

Sex 'changeable': commission backs trans woman's case
By Miklos Bolza
Updated September 26 2023 - 2:10pm, first published 2:04pm

A trans woman suing after being blocked from a women-only social media platform has been backed by the Australian Human Rights Commission in her case.
Roxanne Tickle is suing Giggle for Girls in the Federal Court after having her access to the app revoked in September 2021.

Maintaining her appearance as a woman since 2017, Ms Tickle underwent gender-affirming surgery in October 2019 and was issued a birth certificate stating she was female the following year.

Giggle for Girls, which cites itself as "made for women by women", blocked Ms Tickle in 2021 after considering her male.

After the platform failed to get the lawsuit thrown out in June, the AHRC was called on as a "friend of the court" to make submissions on whether Ms Tickle's case was validly brought.

Sex Discrimination Commissioner Anna Cody dismissed Giggle for Girls' arguments that sex was a biological, binary characteristic under which someone could simply be classified as either a man or a woman.
"'Sex' can refer to a person being male, female or another non-binary status," she wrote.
"It is also broad enough to encompass the idea that a person's 'sex' can be changed."

To determine whether someone was female, a court merely needed to determine what their birth certificate stated and, if trans, they had undergone gender-affirming surgery.
"At least as early as the 1990s, it has been accepted that 'sex' is changeable and that the female 'sex' includes a person who has undergone gender-affirming surgery to affirm their status as female," Ms Cody wrote.
In making the submission, she rejected Giggle for Girls' claims the lawsuit should have been filed as a sex discrimination case, saying the allegations were actually of gender identity discrimination.
"A trans woman may say that her gender identity is female, but (the Sex Discrimination Act) would still protect her from direct discrimination on the ground that she was identified by the discriminator as a trans woman and was treated less favourably than a person with a different gender identity as a result."
Giggle for Girls' claims it could dodge the lawsuit because it was a "special measure" put in place to help women avoid discrimination were also rejected.

Under such measures, marginalised groups can receive preferential treatment to achieve equality.
Ms Cody said the social media platform was a special measure that could not be sued for sex discrimination but gender identity claims could still be brought against it.
"A person who aims to achieve substantive equality between men and women should not also be permitted to engage in discrimination against persons with a certain gender identity," she wrote.
The commissioner also dismissed Giggle for Girls' claims that parts of the act regarding gender identity and the definition of "sex" were constitutionally invalid.
In a statement filed with the human rights commission in December 2021, before the Federal Court case was launched, Ms Tickle outlined the alleged discrimination.
"I believe that I am being discriminated against by being provided with extremely limited functionality of a smart phone app by the app provider compared to that of other users because I am a transgender woman," Ms Tickle wrote.
"I am legally permitted to identify as female."
Giggle and its chief executive Sally Grover did not know Ms Tickle was transgender and it did not inform the decision to revoke her access, lawyers wrote in response to the complaint in March last year.
Ms Grover described Ms Tickle as a "trans-identified male" in a social media post less than three weeks later.
She added that Ms Tickle wanted her to be "re-educated".
Ms Tickle is seeking damages, a written apology and restored access to the platform.
The case has been set down for a four-day hearing in April next year.

I just can’t with the stupid Anna Cody dismissed Giggle for Girls' arguments that sex was a biological, binary characteristic under which someone could simply be classified as either a man or a woman.
"'Sex' can refer to a person being male, female or another non-binary status," she wrote.
"It is also broad enough to encompass the idea that a person's 'sex' can be changed..”

Maintaining her appearance as a woman since 2017

Have these people ever seen this person? There's a good clip on a talk show.

Unfuckingbelievable.

"A trans woman may say that her gender identity is female, but (the Sex Discrimination Act) would still protect her from direct discrimination on the ground that she was identified by the discriminator as a trans woman and was treated less favourably than a person with a different gender identity as a result."

So transwoman is a different "gender identity" from women now? I thought it was supposed to be one and the same?

So transwoman is a different "gender identity" from women now? I thought it was supposed to be one and the same?

No no no no no my sweet child. If we were all same, how would anyone know where to direct the threats of rape and violence, or the visits from the police, and who needed crowdfunding to take their employers to court for sacking them?

Transwomen are the most stunning and brave oppressed women, though, of course.

There is significant issues with the AHRC it seems. With this and with the rejection of the claim for exemption for the exclusion of males from lesbian events. That is going to hold back progress in securing sex based rights being sex based again.

It is madness. Proper topsy-turvy stuff.

What adds to the horror of this is that it is a woman who is making these declarations. How can you be a sex discrimination commissioner AND a woman, and not see how irrational and harmful it all is?

Australia is captured, dangerous and categorically anti-female.

Oh gosh. I really feel for Sal. I contributed to the crowdfunding but I don't feel optimistic about the chances of winning this. Australia got everything well and truly stitched up before anyone knew anything about all this.

There is significant issues with the AHRC it seems.

It reminds me of the ridiculous Canadian one, which Yaniv used as a weapon to target mostly low earning self employed immigrant female beauticians for trumped up "discrimination" claims.

Just bumping this thread because I just saw a YT notification that Sall Grover is on Triggernometry tonight.

The long-form interview with Sall Grover is on now:

The Triggernometry interview is very good and Sall seems like a force of nature.

The crowdfunder says the trial date is 9 April, so not long to go (and still quite a bit of gardening needed).

.

Bumping this thread. The case of Tickle vs Giggle has now reached Australia’s Federal Court. There could be international implications from the ruling.

I haven’t heard anything from the Australian media about this.

https://twitter.com/salltweets/status/1762372521478013266?s=46&t=v_dyQOsjuTO3FaEMMOgsqw

What is so extraordinary is that Giggle has a policy of allowing transwomen anyway. It is only the sex-screening App that is not accepting their application and it is stated by Giggle that this can be manually over turned.

So the court case seems to be against the idea that sex can ever be determined by physical appearance. I am not sure how a judgement that it can’t be could ever be valid though, as it would mean no skeletons have ever been correctly sexed/there is no such thing as sex.

(As a slight derailment: It seems Australia sees gender surgery as part of what makes a transwoman a woman.
Here though isn’t it against human rights to expect genital surgery in order to get trans status? And here most transwomen have intact genitalia.)

I thought that Giggle was initially trans inclusive, but then the owner educated herself and it became female only?

I read that they were allowed but after several transwomen members became abusive towards other members they were banned.

This was a couple of weeks ago. Watch from around 3.40 onwards although around 5 minutes is where it gets into definitions. I’m not even sure if the woman talking actually feels comfortable saying what she’s saying (look at her hands).

Not how she describes it on triggernometry

I am sorry for being misleading then. I read that Giggle were transwoman inclusive in what must have been an out of date article. ( I was surprised too because of the high possibility of aggressive behaviour Giggle would end up having in their midst.)

I had based that wrong information (that Giggle was transwoman inclusive) on the 2020 4W article in the OP and missed this at the top:

Update (1/15/21):* Since this story was published, the Giggle policy on inclusion has changed. Giggle is now an exclusively "female only space".

Initially Sall would have overturned some potential men however Roxy Tickle obtained her phone number and started messaging her personally. And so Sall decided to block him.

No you won't as it's potentially massive from a legal and political pov.

It's basically Sal v the government, even though it's actually tickle. As it's a test of their laws and proclamations about twaw.