Chucked out of FB group - Host a Sister

[Patty2012]

So, I got kicked out of a FB group today. It's called 'Host a Sister'. It's basically couch-surfing for women, but it's also something that's been used by women fleeing war-torn areas or domestic violence. The whole group is intended to be a safe space for women who travel and who would like to be hosted by other women - for obvious reasons.
A "queer, non-binary" couple - one woman, one man - otherwise known as a straight couple - were looking for somewhere to stay in Amsterdam. they looked pretty alternative and explained they were into the party scene. They came across as decent people. There must have been a few comments about one of them being a man though because the admin complained about how mean people were being, how offensive and how it was supposed to be an inclusive group and a safe space for women to travel. Hundreds and hundreds of women in the group agreed with the admin. And I just don't get it. So, I said so. And boom! Kicked out.
How can these women not see it? How can they not see that predatory men need only say they're trans or non-binary to gain access to their homes? Or that they could be travelling and end up being tricked into staying in a man's house. This is why the group was created in the first place! I don't understand it. And there's no debate. I raised a concern and was ousted from the group. Why can't we just talk about it? Why don't those women know what the word "sister" means? Where are we going with this? It feels like the battle is already lost.
AND - this is turning into a waffling rant - a few weeks ago, someone who I considered a very close friend - a man - texted me to ask me why I seemed to be so obsessed with women who have penises these days. I just replied, "There's no such thing as a woman with a penis" and he hasn't spoken to me since. We're CLOSE friends. And it's over. He's a big leftie - as am I - but doesn't seem to have put any thought into this. He just sees me as being unkind. I don't know what to do about it. Why would I suddenly be unkind? He KNOWS me. He KNOWS I'm not unkind.

How depressing - it's the lack of discussion which I find disturbing, and the seeming lack of any type of intelligent engagement with the subject. The group was set up to protect women from men, this is necessary for a distressing number of women. How can it make sense for them to blindly accept any man who feels they have a right to be there - have the risks to women magically disappeared?

@Patty2012 you were only his friend while you agree with what he says, that's what I'm seeing more and more with 'leftie' type people I know. The 'we are the most tolerant and accepting' stance only lasts as long as you toe their line.

I am reminded of this case:

To a group of women from around the world who had come to vacation near Venice, Italy, he seemed like the perfect host. He had all the right online reviews, and was even a police officer. But when the lights went down this sexual predator drugged and assaulted his guests. Across continents and years, these fearless women found each other to bring him to justice. Together, with a relentless team of Italian journalists, they faced down every obstacle thrown at them and triggered an unprecedented trial in Italian court.

Hosted by investigative reporter Natasha Del Toro, this ten-episode, immersive true crime series examines the trust we place in the sharing economy and the power that a simple checkmark or digital review can hold over our lives.

https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/pdst.fm/e/chrt.fm/track/G481GD/traffic.megaphone.fm/ADV1785403682.mp3?updated=1642696649

I'm also depressed and disturbed by the total refusal to engage.

I was permanently banned from the Surfing subreddit today. Someone had posted about Bethany Hamilton boycotting the WSL if they allow transgender competitors in the women's competition. The comments were all so critical of her so I put forward a very factual point about differences in physiology. Next thing I had a message from the mods saying I was permanbanned. Message then back to discuss and their response was to mute me.

I got in touch with a couple of other people who had posted in a similar vein to me and they got banned too. The whole thread is peppered with deletions.

OP I'm sorry you had the same experience and I'm really sorry you lost a real-life friend to this. It all feels so unfair and frustrating.

Here's a write up of the couch surfing rapist

https://www.smh.com.au/world/italian-couchsurfing-rapist-hundreds-of-women-allegedly-assaulted-20150206-137kmf.html

It’s both depression and utterly ridiculous.

You can’t argue with it though OP so the only advice I can give is to not engage with people who won’t or can’t have a civilised debate or conversation. By that I literally just mean a “this is my opinion, that is yours, here’s some middle ground” - we don’t have to even try to convince each other. Just be able to say hmm I’m not so sure, without being labelled a big ole Terf, bigot, homophobic etc.

At this point terf isn’t even an insult because it doesn’t even mean you are against trans people, now it is you don’t 100% agree without question or debate. Even in our justice system we allow for “reasonable doubt” - but gender ideology. NO! It’s 100% compliance or you are devil reincarnate.

it’s so boring and entitled. It’s like arguing with a toddler. So there really is no point.

I make my views clear when asked. If the person does not respect my right to an opinion then they are not someone I want to continue to engage with anyway.

Don’t waste your energy on arguing with people who aren’t prepared to have logical, reasonable discussion

Why can't we just talk about it?

Because if you talk about it someone would eventually have to give some logical explanation as to why this bloke gets to be in the women only couch surfing group but all the others don't.

What possible reason could there be? There is just no argument that makes any sense. So the only solution is 'no debate'.

I looked at that thread earlier. The mod of the sub is trans, probably the one that booted you.

Reddit is a loss cause because so many subs have trans activist mods.

It is depressing beyond belief. The entitlement is mind blowing too. Why target a group called ‘host a sister’ when both members of the couple know one of them is a man? The women who go along with this movement genuinely bewilder me. The woman in that couple cannot really believe the man she presumably has sex with is anything other than a man.

There is nothing more enraging than women being expected to always have “compassion” and “be kind” to what men want, and it doesn’t matter if it’s one women or thousands in a group or organization, the man’s special feels come first. One boy or man trumps as many girls and woman that you have available because we are literally invisible in our own spaces.

And we are prevented from publicly talking about it, so many women don’t see that they are selling out their own sex and just play front line hand maidens that any man can hide behind.

They don’t blink at a rapist being in locked up with incarcerated women.

Facebook is training admins to be "inclusive " - they have a special group for admins called Power Admins, run by fb staff. In it, admins get trained to hunt to bigot (eg people that believe in biological reality), presumably Facebook is after Stonewall points. Clearly mainly admins will have arrived at no debate by themselves too.

Maniacs.
Of course men shouldn't be allowed in a women's only hosting group. Well done for speaking up.

And it was good to see the Bethany Hamilton story break! I'm so sick of gc women being bullied

beachgrit.com/2023/02/world-surf-league-broadsided-by-surf-legends-including-kelly-slater-shane-dorian-bethany-hamilton-and-its-own-north-shore-water-patrol-loudly-denouncing-new-policy-allowing-trans-women-to-compete/

I looked at that thread earlier. The mod of the sub is trans, probably the one that booted you.

The number of trans people in the surfing community must be tiny, what a coincidence.

Why target a group called ‘host a sister’ when both members of the couple know one of them is a man?

Because that's what these people actively go out of the way to do. It's their activism.

Complete truth 👏

Reddit mods on surf subs are probably more Reddit mod than surfer! Some mods are on duty on a hundred subs or more.

Someone even says in that thread that the actual surf world is likely a lot less trans supportive than the Reddit surfing sub (paraphrase).

It’s wild how many tech world people are men who say they are women. The top 5 ‘female’ gaming speedrunners are all male.

This has been a massive contributor to the ideology getting a foothold, people haven’t been able to voice what they actually think (deleted, banned) which has made it seem like most people believe in this stuff. They don’t
Glad Kelly Slater has also spoken out re: preserving/protecting m women’s surfing. If only Tony Hawk would do the same in skating!

The number of trans people in the surfing community must be tiny, what a coincidence.

Mods are gate keepers. Gate keepers hold a lot of power. Power as ‘manipulation’ ie, power in being able to manipulate what is on an agenda or what gets kept off an agenda. Exactly what mods get to do.

All the much more powerful for being unseen and largely unaccountable. They just get to literally hit the delete button and dissenters are silenced. You can see how very very appealing that would be to a group of people with a particular agenda that doesn’t hold up to logical debate.

To paraphrase, power is to such people as oxygen is to breathing. They’ll seek it any and everywhere.

You made that couple feel marginalised you were right to be kicked out it's an inclusive group. They were open about who they were. You could choose to host or not

you were right to be kicked out it's an inclusive group

Pissing myself laughing, as they say.

And again - an individual’s feelings are expected to trump concerns about womens safety.

But not “inclusive” of OP? Who was erm <checks notes> a woman, in a women’s group started to help women.

You made that couple feel marginalised you were right to be kicked out it's an inclusive group. They were open about who they were. You could choose to host or not

In that case all they need to do is change the name of the group from "Host a Sister" to "Host a Sibling" because the entire point of having a group to help women find safe places to stay with other women has been lost.

Nope, it's an EXCLUSIVE group -- it excludes MEN. Or at least, it should. That's its raison d'etre, surely. I think, maddy68, you may have missed the whole point of the group.

What gets me most -- well, one of the things that get me - is that this sort of behaviour (banning without right of appeal) is usually carried out by people who decry "binary thinking" and discrimination. Yet what could display binary thinking and discrimination more clearly than "I'm right, you're wrong, no appeal or justification allowed, f* off" ?

Non binary people, by their own definition, are not women, @maddy68. Sterling input from you, as ever.

The reason they ban you from the group is that the alternative - to allow an open debate and discussion of different viewpoints - is terrifying to them. Their house is built on sand and they know it. They have to suppress discussion, otherwise the whole thing collapses.

Raison d'etre . Host a Sister no longer has one if they also host a brother / boyfriend/ random guy who is probably OK. That's not the point is it.