Why is there 'no LGB without the T'?

[Righthandcider]

Something’s been going around my head in circles.

I’ve seen the mantra ‘No LGB without the T’ repeated in several places.

But exactly why have so many LGB organisations aligned themselves with trans hook, line and sinker? I mean one might argue that well-meaning LGB groups have been sucked in by TRAs who are blatantly piggy backing, borrowing the legacy of the gay liberation movement to shut down any debate by making it seem backwards and ‘phobic’ to question them in any way. But LGB groups themselves obviously don’t see the relationship this way. Most of them don’t seem to think they’re being used.

So what is it that they think they have in common with trans activists? Isn’t there a bloody huge elephant in the room? LGB rights are about ensuring nobody is treated differently because of their sexuality. That's literally what unites lesbian, gay and bi people.

I thought the party line for trans rights is that being trans is separate from and independent of a person’s sexuality. It’s simply about whether they feel they are male, female, neither or both.

So where’s the overlap? Why are LGB groups giving their energy to fighting for the ‘T’, to the point of saying there’s ‘no LGB without it’, if it’s not about sexuality?

Is it because they actually feel deep down that it IS about sexuality?

That it’s partly about same sex attraction, in that a lot of gay people still feel the pressure of homophobia and would rather be transed out of it?

That it’s partly about autogynaephilia, in that many cross dressers can now hold their heads high as stunning and brave better versions of 'cis' women, while enjoying the fulfilment of their ultimate sexual fantasy?

If it’s not either of those things, then where exactly is the natural connection between LBG and T? The only explanation I’ve seen anywhere is that ‘they are another marginalised group’. But there are many other marginalised groups, so why join with this one in particular?

I’m interested to hear people’s views.

Anyone?!

I don't get it either. I have no answers but the same questions.

Im looking for an emoji person with cash signs in their eyes but cant find one.

oh, well. Its money. The reason is money.

I think it is a combination of things, but probably it was initially a bit of forced teaming in that the TRAs were likening their demands to the totally different fight for equality for LGB previously.

Then Stonewall et al got in on it

And then there's the Denton's document which recommends hitching an unpopular cause to an accepted / acceptable one.

One final thought - there was a woman at the Newcastle Let Women Speak at the weekend who told the gathered crowd about hypnotherapy and how repeating mantras until your brain starts to believe them is a thing - eg TWAW, so perhaps there's also a bit of that going on?

The myth that a transwomen threw the first brick at Stonewall. That person wasn't there . They turned up later and were not a transwomen. They said so themselves.

🤑🤑

There is now, it’s the LGB Alliance.

As pp say it was security in numbers or perhaps as things came to pass, hiding in plain sight.

Stonewall needed a new mission once gay rights were achieved. Otherwise everyone working there would lose their jobs.

Trans people have always been part of the Lesbian and Gay movement that is because a lot of them are homosexual.

The modern development is that heterosexual trans women want to be part of the club too

I can sort of understand at the beginning when Stonewall were looking for a new cause.

But what I don't understand is why do many stick with the T now it's become apparent that their beliefs don't match. I mean the cotton ceiling should have been the thing that split them but no some still stick with the forced teaming.

It makes no sense.

Read "The End of the World is Flat". Hilarious parody

Forced teaming.

And yes, Stonewall achieved their objective so needed a new raison d'etre.

Money.

Exactly. You can see how it might have started, and even how it gained momentum (Stonewall etc needing a new cause to fight for as pps suggest).

But I just don't get why so many persist, so fiercely, in swallowing TRAs' version of the world and shouting la-la-la-transphobia at everything else.

It's fairly obvious that most politicians, journalists, leaders of institutions on the 'be kind' and TWAW side just haven't done their own digging into this issue and woken up.

But I just can't understand how people who are not trans themselves but seemingly eat, breathe and sleep trans rights are still just unaware of / able to ignore the stuff GC people talk about. How can they be unaware of all the black pampers activity, the likes of Barbie Kardashian, detransitioners coming out, the huge surge in GNC girls butchering their bodies, the gay conversion 'jokes' at the Tavistock, the shit show at Mermaids (and S Green's Ted Talk!), the growing number of Youtubers such as Menno sharing reams of evidence of predatory behaviour by straight men in lipstick and knickers. And tonnes of other calm, reasonable, intelligent evidence-backed commentary.

Thanks, I will.

It's mad, because homophobia is central to trans doctrine.

After all, it is transphobic to have genital preferences, or so we are told.

I can only conclude that the T is seeking to use the LGB as a Trojan Horse, like NAMBLA did in the 70s.

Christians who do bad things are not Christians?

Agree with this.

One reason seems to be that for many gay men being gender nonconforming and playing with gender stereotypes has always been part of their experience and different gay subcultures (Drag, Voguing). So they have empathy for gay men who prefer female roles. That’s often the impression I get, that by not aligning with the trans movement they feel they are abandoning other gay men, throwing them under the bus, or are hostile to the idea that they can’t continue to play around with gender themselves.

Now we have the language that trans people are being rejected and threatened by the dominant culture and again, I am sure many gay men identify strongly with that experience. I say gay men, because the Pink Pound has a lot of economic influence, plenty of gay men are in influential positions and don’t see any disadvantage in not embracing the trans agenda.

To clarify, I am not suggesting all gay men think this way, but I do think there are enough gay men who are pro a very fluid approach when it comes to sex and gender. Especially the younger guys who just like the rest of their generation have been strongly encouraged to embrace gender ideology as legitimate.

After all, it is transphobic to have genital preferences, or so we are told.

If a butch lesbian transitions she becomes a straight 'man'. No more pressure to accept penis.

Er...OK but what about her girlfriend or wife, who might not want to be married to a 'straight man'?

Google "Denton's document"

The Tavistock soon believe that there won't be any LGB due to the T.

We've ended up with reverse homophobia by now transing the gay away. We're getting like Iran.

I'm a B and I've always resented the T being added as it's not even remotely the same.
The LGB I know feel the same!

Sorry if I sound stupid, didn’t it used to just be:
“The LGB community” a while ago ?