Women's rights general conversations - Thread 2

[Kucingsparkles]

Continuation of Thread 1

There is so much excellent information and so many active discussions on FWR that I wondered if it would be useful to have a thread to sort of "cross-fertilise" between them - airing little thoughts or vignettes that wouldn't themselves merit their own thread, to highlight other posts/threads of particular interest or to point to notable developments on fast-moving threads so that casual observers know where to look.

(For example, "the X thread has meandered onto a fascinating discussion of Y" or "Poster P's amazing analysis on thread Z might have relevance to the scenario in thread W" or even "Random bloke asked me to smile while I was choosing onions, grr"- that sort of thing).

NeighbourhoodWatchPotholeDivision · Today 14:51

I hope that the papers get hold of that. Trying to exclude people from participation in the democratic process, because they disagree with you is outrageous.

It's almost as if they don't understand what democracy is....

poetrywitch.mn.co/posts/30455970 

@Britinme thanks for the queering article link. Really interesting.

Re where I am politically. I've always been on the left and won't move from there no matter how much others, who I profoundly disagree with, try to mangle it. Eventually they'll have a pejorative name for us because they can't shift us. They couldn't completely claim feminism, call those who refuse to budge a bad name, ditto left wingers. I guess they're already doing that by calling us right wing bigots.

Knowing where I am politically, however, is not the same as having a home in any party. I will remain homeless until a left party remembers what a woman is.

They used to be fairly terrible on women, but with two women leaders n and s I have to assume they've changed somewhat.

Up here they were actually not bad when I moved to NI. One of the first Stormont debates I watched after arriving 10 years ago had several SF members speaking in favour of women's rights and equal pay. And they were - in NI terms - relatively pro☆ choice. Opposition to the DUP I'm sure being a primary driver.

At the last election their manifesto was decidedly fence-sitting - supporting both GRA reform and women's rights but not putting any specifics of what that meant in writing. I've not yet looked since the mutterings started about a new election.

☆ Not, of course actually pro, but considerably less anti than many. They at least supported allowing it for rape, fatal fetal abnormality and similar rather than a total ban.

My doubts about them on women are rooted in the way Máiría Cahill was treated. Another example of powerful men's egos being more important than a woman's lived experience. They do seem possibly the best bet next time around - at least I can transfer my vote as often as I want to.

I'd love an international, cross country, in all countries in the world, women's party dedicated to the preservation of women's rights, to women's welfare and women's general betterment.

A woman who runs a support group for women who have miscarried is challenged to prove that some men will try to attend such groups. She gives examples. They are apparently not enough.

mobile.twitter.com/thatveganlass/status/1605982576706875392

They are apparently not enough.

It's always N+1 isn't it?

@Britinme Thanks for linking to Ceri's piece. My god, it's so very familiar, it gives me chills (exiles may know the posters I'm thinking of)!

Ha ha, it does remind me of The Other Place's very own Humpty Dumpty.

Arguing with a queer theorist, you’ll have worked out by now, is like arguing with a fish. None of the arguments are very strong, but put them all together and that’s one slippery little bastard.

@Britinme thank you for the link to Ceri's article I feel like printing the above out large and framing it!

Very good article. It reminded me not only of [particular Humpty Dumpty], but also of some of the disagreements I had with some modules of my degree (which never when anywhere near queer theory - I'm a scientist - but did touch on people like Piaget and Chomsky☆).

I've never understood how some schools of thought were and are unable to comprehend the differences between language, thought and reality. The adamant assertions that one can only think, remember or construct ideas in words have always baffled me. Postmodern and queer theories taking it beyond that to the idea that words are or make reality is just ... [proving my point there, I have a very clear idea indeed of what it is, but words are really not sufficient to convey my strength of feeling].

☆ I find the latter to be sound on a lot, but he's a big fan of the shifting goalpost when it comes to language and communication as specifically human traits.

Good article. Could never have been linked to at the old place, Britinme. Cheers. (Substacks do need an editor, though).

I felt for some time that I must be missing something in queer theory, so I kept asking and reading. I'm now reasonably sure that I'm not missing anything and that it's nothing more than I had already understood pretty clearly. And nothing much in terms of actual thinking, either, despite the apparent respect it garners.

The ultimate queering that Ceri refers to, where the sense of self as distinct from non-self is queered, is perfectly familiar in other philosophies too, where both theory and praxis is rather more developed.

• when + went

Oh - turns out you can't do a - at the start of a line here. Ah well, you'll work it out.

The GC=RW thing is so odd. Predictably, I came out as bottom left quadrant on the Political Compass thing. Because I think corporations needs proper regulation, redistribution of wealth is essential to mitigate against all the money flowing to a few people, gay people should be able to live their lives, abortion is a fundamental women's right, women should be allowed careers, there is no 'superior', 'civilised' race, cultures will mix and evolve. All crazy stuff!

Yup

I’m also bottom left on the political compass thing which fits with my perception of my politics as not being far right but what do I know (except that I feel politically homeless at the moment).

Were are we all going to go? I don't want to have to vote, whispers, Conservative, in fact the thought of it actually makes me shudder. I'm not sure at the crunch point I could actually do it. But I sure as hell 100% could not put my cross by Labour at the moment

Wasn't controversial just a few years ago. Personally, I sure as shit ain't ever voting Tory. If there's a fringe candidate who talks sense on this, I'll consider it, otherwise its spoilt ballot time. But I will not vote Labour, Lib Dem, or Green, as things stand.

Just a thought here: would it be a good thing if someone came up with a brief phrase or slogan that could be used to spoil ballot papers in this situation, that might be picked up by social media and become a thing? Or am I talking bollocks here?

We could just write the word WOMAN straight across them all

Well yes, Bb, something like that was what I meant.

@Boiledbeetle that is an excellent idea! That or, Adult Human Female.

I wrote “Respect my SEX if you want my X” in suffragette colours (I have a postal vote so had access to coloured pens).