Redefinition of 'Woman'

[InterestingUsernameTBC]

So this has been swirling round in my head for a bit and I thought I'd put it down here and see if anyone has any comments.

In order for women to accept a male as a woman they have to redefine what it is to be a woman in his image.

It seems to me that some women say, that's fine. I'm happy to accept your redefinition. That doesn't contradict my own identity as a woman. We're both women, you're a trans woman and I'm a cis woman.

And then there are others who say, I accept your redefinition of what a woman is but it doesn't fit with my identity as a woman so I must be non binary or a trans man.

And then there are women who say fuck off. I'm not redefining what it is to be a woman to suit any man. But how do these women hold onto their sense of self in a society that is seeking to redefine their identity and the language they use to describe it?

Because woman isn't my identity, it's a fact about me not a core part of my personality. I'm just me, human and complex.

Probably the easiest thing to do would be to cede the word ‘woman’ sad come up with a new word that means biological woman and base policy on that.
I can imagine how this idea is going to go down on here!

That wouldn't work, Tofu, as whatever the new word is would immediately become coveted by those wanted to force themselves into the definition of women. It's the group that the word is associated with, not the word itself.

It's happening already with women using female to try to talk about women. The word female is now cropping up being used by trans identifying males to describe themselves.

It might if boundaries are set before the definition was used. And also who it excludes.

That sports guy, Ross someone calls it ‘the retreat position’.

I honestly hope that’s satire… it’s so hard to tell nowadays.

Nope.

This

"Boundaries set". Yeah, ok, I don't know if it's escaped your notice but women's boundaries have been trampled on by gender ideologues. They aren't going to leave us a word if we ask nicely. If it describes women, they will want to take it.

It has not escaped my attention.

Some people have already tried to work that way, using the word "female". Given it's strict biological definition, people reasonably thought it might work as a biological vs constructed term.

All that happened was that transwomen quickly began using it too.

The thing is a section of society consider woman and female to mean things that they are not. It’s been bastardised. But what if a totally new word was used with upfront biological boundaries. Large gamates etc. strip it of any sociological nonsense upfront.

It wouldn’t work tofu for exactly the reasons already outlined.

And also frankly, why the fuck should we give up a word that until 5 minutes ago every knew meant adult human female just to appease a minority of deluded men?

And it's not just about the future. If we accept that woman also means male, what about the centuries of poetry, music etc that refer to women- will future generations think that it all refers to men too? It all sounds like cultural erasure and appropriation to me.

Because there are more important things at stake. If a new word enables sex based protections, they can keep it.

That’s a good point.

I don't identify as a woman. I am a woman. It is stamped into every cell of my body. I am of the class that has, throughout history and prehistory, been oppressed for our biology. And it is that shared biology that makes us women.

@InterestingUsernameTBC - "But how do these women hold onto their sense of self in a society that is seeking to redefine their identity and the language they use to describe it?"

We've been using the same terms for hundreds of years. I've been using the same terms for the whole of my adult life. Why would anyone have any problem holding onto their sense of self?

I was idly daydreaming about using the word wombman for just this purpose earlier today!

I don't like the man part, but the womb part is purely ours, surely? Is this even the origin of the word woman?

I can imagine the word might be upsetting for some women who've lost their womb, and I'd hate for that to happen. It might also be triggering for some transwomen who don't want to be reminded that they don't have wombs. I'm less worried about their feelings unsurprisingly.

Wow. Ok.

Given the word woman

1. Used to afford sex based protections
2. Has been re-defined to mean basically anyone who fancies using it

Why on earth would anyone think just coming up with a new word would have a different outcome? The mind boggles.

Oh… and why the fuck should we?

It might if boundaries are set before the definition was used. And also who it excludes.

They don't want woman now. They consider that battle one.

They want female. Because we can still differentiate ourselves by saying female.

Next They will be after mother. They will be demanding they are mother on a child's birth certificate.

It’s an idea I’ve thought about a few times.
I get you’re not a fan!

Because if your sense of self includes the knowledge that you are a woman due to being an adult female human. And then it is decided that a woman can be male or female then what is a woman? What are you if there is no word for a female adult human?

And if there is no word for female adult humans then aren't these people being denied the language they need to talk about themselves as a group, their shared experiences, shared discrimination?