Sexual choking is now so common that many young people don’t think it even requires consent. That’s a problem

[IwantToRetire]

" ... It made me sad to think about the amount of girls who would have just “gone along with it” in that moment – including myself a few years ago. I would have known myself well enough to know that being choked wasn’t something that sexually turned me on, however I don’t know if I would have been able to distinguish between enjoying a sexual encounter because the man I was with was enjoying it, or because I truly enjoyed it myself.

I worry about how many women are yet to make this distinction, and implore you to consider where the true source of your consent lies, because if it is with the desire to satisfy men who want to strangle you, it may be wrongly placed. ... "

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/dec/08/sexual-choking-is-now-so-common-that-many-young-people-dont-think-it-even-requires-consent-thats-a-problem

Not saying this is the best article ever about this increasing violence inspired by pornograpy, and suspect the Guardian only published it because the writer is one of the BBC's 100 women.

But on the other hand this cant be said to often enough, and if it reaches one young woman, or in fact any woman, then that's good.

Sounds horrible. I wonder if there is also a rise in young men being choked by women in sex. I suspect not. It's a violence thing not a sexual pleasure thing.

I think that's the problem with this article. It uses language like people, rather than the actuality of male violence.

This has been going on for years, and there have been campaigns about it.

And recently "non fatal strangulation" was recognised as an act of domestic violence. www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/non-fatal-strangulation-or-non-fatal-suffocation

And there was a recent zoom meeting organised by feminists in the US because a nurse has spoken up about an increase in violence between children / siblings that is clearly influenced by pornography.

It's disgusting enough that young women thinking they are having consensual sex with a man can then be subected to violence, but the fact that young children and now also imitating this is horrific.

I just get so sad at being a girl or woman today. I know being sad doesn't help. But I am.

I get so angry! And that doesn’t help either.
All I can think of doing is talking about it to the younger people, men as well as women. They will cringe… Tough.

It’s a very dangerous practice. It used to be rather more common - am I allowed to say this- amongst men as an auto erotic practice. Better not say who, but forty years ago a landowner was found strangled in a wardrobe where he had been hanging himself whilst……you can fill this in for yourself.

Its only a matter of time before some poor girl is killed by this practice.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/sep/07/darlington-man-jailed-for-four-years-for-choking-woman-during-sex

It has already happened. The man who killed her only got sentenced for 4 years and the woman cannot testify as to whether it was consensual or not because she is dead.

Consent for these "kinks" is used by men to justify their abuse and violence towards women. How can a woman consent to self-harm and how can that supposed consent not be questioned?

If a woman asked a man to strangle her in a non-sexual scenario, most men would say no. How does sex make this consent issue any different?

Mumsnet supported the successful campaign to legislate against this abhorrent practice and the wonderful women who led the We can't consent to this campaign.

www.mumsnet.com/news/mumsnet-joins-we-cant-consent-to-this-campaign#:~:text=We%20Can't%20Consent%20To%20This%20aims%20to%20change%20the,a%20couple%20of%20years%20ago.

I was watching a Netflix series, ‘Locke and Key’ and there was a sexual strangulation scene. The female bad/evil character had this done to her by a man, then she took control to do this to him resulting in his deliberate death. I was shocked as this was billed as a 15 (happy to be corrected) and watching with my teens, both comfortably over 16. It was the fact the act was quite casually initiated by the man in a random encounter, it was very disturbing. It was never mentioned in the program. Didn’t add to the story, except to cement her as evil but this had been established.

You never hear of female auto asphyxiation gone wrong. If women enjoyed the actual experience, rather than the experience of pleasing the man, surely you would?

This is one of the things (just one, I also have no opportunity right now anyway) that's putting me off getting out there and dating again - I just want nice, pleasant, mutually enjoyable sex. I don't want to be strangled or slapped .

The thing is, the bolshy bit of me says that if these men want this, they should go first, but then the voice in my head says that I don't want to strangle anyone. And I just don't understand why anyone would.

Exactly, it's so bizarre. I think some men don't even know why they do it either other than mimicking what they've seen in porn because that's how they've "learned sex". It's rendered them incapable of developing an original sexuality based on empathy and imagination. On top of that, porn is like another universe where suddenly everyone's incapable of critical thought and rampant misogyny goes unchecked. So men and women unthinkingly go along with these abusive acts.

A medical article I read in 2019 stated that the harmful effects of being strangled during sex sometimes only appear after a week or two, and that those include an increased stroke risk.

I am also fairly certain that what is discussed here is being strangled during sex, not choked, but perhaps the usage has changed.

I am also fairly certain that what is discussed here is being strangled during sex, not choked, but perhaps the usage has changed.

Yes... choking is an obstruction, strangulation is compression.
I would guess the former started to be used deliberately for sexual strangulation by apologists for this dangerous practice because it sounds more innocent. Choking is something that usually happens accidentally; strangulation less so.

Let's call it what it is. Strangulation.

I would guess the former started to be used deliberately for sexual strangulation by apologists for this dangerous practice because it sounds more innocent. Choking is something that usually happens accidentally; strangulation less so.
Let's call it what it is. Strangulation.

Exactly. It's a deliberate act of deliberate harm.

This is the first I came across it.

A light-hearted Instagram page about confessions/embarrassing moments.

It's casually dropped into the last sentence and I just found it incredibly jarring.

It was a few months ago I saw this and I had a look at the comments. There were a few along the lines of "so are we all just choking each other these days, then?" but most didn't mention it, like it was just normal.

In late 30s and I'm fairly certain I don't know anyone that does this. A lot of my friends are very open about sex and I know for sure they don't.

I just cant really get my head around it. Apart from the fact it's bloody dangerous and people have died, it is just not pleasant! Choking is choking. Ie - uncomfortable, frightening, painful, stressful.

The whole thing is just very unsettling.

Yes, it's quite the thought, isn't it?

How old are you?

I know many single in their late 30s / 40s. I don't think this would cross their mind.

I could be wrong but I think it must be younger men. Early 30s maybe and younger. Probably more in their 20s.

The worst bit is that it doesn't matter if you didn't consent to it. If it "goes wrong" he can claim that it was consensual but went wrong, and you're too dead to testify that you didn't consent.

A change in the law is needed quickly, to introduce a presumption that consent to choke wasn't given unless it can be proven otherwise (in writing for example). I know that "innocent until proven guilty" is an important legal principle in our society, but I don't think that a specific exception such as this would undermine that - it still has to be proved that it was he who did the choking.

Lots of women & women have been killed by this practice.

@arthurfonzerelli A few years ago I was seeing a man (we were both mid-twenties) who put his hand on my neck the first (and last!) time we had sex. No warning from him and definitely no indication from me that I would like it. He didn't apply pressure but still all I could think was WTF and I removed his hand and got out of there.

Maybe there is hope for older men, I really hope so. The only thing I would say is that you don't know what goes on behind closed doors. I knew this man from work and from the outside (education, profession, demeanour etc.) he wouldn't have appeared to be the strangling type. I'm scared the behaviour has been so mainstreamed that there is no "strangling type" any more, just the majority. I hope I'm wrong.

I'm late 30s but have friends now just around 30 who seemed to think strangulation was pretty normal. I was horrified when they talked about it.

I'm sure I've seen a sex scene on a TV show that had strangulation just dropped in like it was just totally normal too.

Call it what it is, non fatal strangulation. You choke on a grape.
I find using the correct terminology makes people pay more attention to the issue.

Children in schools get the message from all the porn soaked / queer theory groups who have colonised sex ed teaching that porn / kink / fetish / degrading women is the done thing. Once you sell the the message that extreme porn is normal / acceptable to young children, their boundaries are fatally compromised. They go on to access age inappropriate content online with some unwary schools using materials from numerous dubious organisations. It's a depressing list. Transgender Trend have detailed many of the dodgy groups - here's their take on the misnamed Proud Trust:
www.transgendertrend.com/proud-trust-nothing-proud/

I like it sometimes when dp puts his hands on my throat during (with no pressure). Not chocking though. I get the impression he doesn’t like doing it at all, and tbh I suppose I’m glad. I’d feel terrified if someone started choking me during sex. I’m 25, I wouldn’t say it’s normal for my age group so it must be those younger- which is even more worrying.

I'm in my 40s, so perhaps I stand a chance..

but my ex, same age was certainly strongly influenced by porn and the (I can say it now) abusive sex didn't involve strangulation, but his hand strayed close a couple of times, and he was far to rough in general.

It is like they turn their brains off - in what other circumstance would they take this risk with the woman they (supposedly) love? The only other circumstance I hear of choking is MMA fighting - and there, using your hands to choke someone out is an illegal move - exactly because it's so damn dangerous.

I just want nice, pleasant, mutually enjoyable sex. I don't want to be strangled or slapped .

Whenever I read material like this, I think of Fermat (longstanding MNer, I don't know if she's NC) who said (back in 2017/18?) that if she ever started dating, she would tell friends so that they should know that she has a written document where she testifies that she is only interested in plain, 'vanilla' sex. Fermat states that if she is injured or dies at the hands of someone claiming a 'rough sex' justification, then people should know it's not true and speak up.