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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Stephen Fry

108 replies

zanahoria · 19/11/2022 12:10

“But it isn’t possible if each side looks on the other as an enemy and the trans people just shout ‘terf’ (trans-exclusionary radical feminist) and the feminists seem to, as it were, undermine the dignity and rights of the trans community, if I can use the word community – it is a bit of a greasy word, but there you go.”

^www.aol.co.uk/stephen-fry-urges-calm-debate-180132887.html^

Stephen Fry urges clam then compares what one side is doing with what the other side seems to be doing

OP posts:
darjeelingrose · 11/12/2022 15:40

FannyCann · 11/12/2022 13:41

And now he's planning on renting a womb to start a family.

He knows what a woman is alright and he may not want to go eat one for sex but he's happy to use them to breed.

Stephen Fry, 65, reveals his biggest regret is not having children
mol.im/a/11525215

You do yourself a disservice really. You have a point to make, clearly about S.Fry, who you mustn't like very much. Who says in this article that
'Elliot and I, we talked about it a bit, but we never talked about it to the extent of ''Right, so, we're going to a clinic tomorrow to talk this through to some expert''.
So he regrets not having kids, had a few chats about children with his husband, but never went as far as actually talking together about doing anything about it. I'm really anti surrogacy, but I can't see how you can take somebody to task for not having done something. Or apparently not really talking about it.

nilsmousehammer · 11/12/2022 16:56

If he ever does make that decision, the poor child will need a therapist pretty much from conception.

BravelyStunning · 11/12/2022 17:27

Datun · 19/11/2022 18:22

I'm so fed up with these people who seem to think that there is any symmetry to the two viewpoints in this issue. There isn't.

It's entirely bloody reasonable for women to not want to get changed in front of random men. It's entirely reasonable to not want male criminals, including rapists and paedophiles, to be housed with incarcerated females. It's actually inhumane to think otherwise.

And, of course, it's entirely reasonable to want to preserve women's sport! Who the hell would think otherwise?

@Datun , thanks for this- you always put things so well. i angrily bluster around and never articulate myself properly! i get so pissed off with the whole "two sides, let's compromise" parts of this ideology vs reality issue- and you've nailed what's been roaming around my woolly head: there is no symmetry- any suggestion that there is leads to manipulation and gaslighting.

EasterIsland · 11/12/2022 20:13

Once again, a pompous man comes in to tell women they should just calm down when an ideology tries to change the fundamental definition of woman and girl.

And once again, someone with no skin in the game can't see the distinction: that resisting and challenging an ideology which seeks to take away women's rights (which are sex-based) is NOT the same as resisting or challenging individuals who take on a trans identity.

Happylittlechicken · 12/12/2022 06:24

If Stephen believes males can be women, as as his husband is still of an age to have children, according to Stephen’s beliefs, why doesn’t the husband just identify as a woman and have a baby. I find it odd that all these men crawling out if the woodwork to try to silence women somehow seem to know exactly what biological sex is when it comes to their romantic partners or desire for a child. Bloody hypocrites.

viques · 12/12/2022 09:34

Is he being nice and soothing because apparently I read somewhere his one regret in life is that he didn’t have children, and if he wants to have children then , surprise surprise, he will need a genuine, biologically complete woman to do the heavy lifting?

ErrolTheDragon · 12/12/2022 10:33

viques · 12/12/2022 09:34

Is he being nice and soothing because apparently I read somewhere his one regret in life is that he didn’t have children, and if he wants to have children then , surprise surprise, he will need a genuine, biologically complete woman to do the heavy lifting?

You can read about that regret in the link upthread which seems pretty clear he's not going down that path.

Wanderingowl · 12/12/2022 11:36

Datun · 19/11/2022 18:43

Oh well, after reading the article, it's unsurprising that he has never thought how awful it would be for women to have to access a rape refuge where a man was pretending to be a woman and told them if they don't agree, they need to 'reframe their trauma'.

It’s a great shame and we’re all very sorry that your uncle touched you in that nasty place – you get some of my sympathy – but your self-pity gets none of my sympathy because self-pity is the ugliest emotion in humanity.”

The 58-year-old went on to say: “Grow up.”

His apology involves him saying that's not what he meant. How the fuck else can you interpret that??

Show quote history

Ok so, I'll be honest and say that while he phrased it very carelessly, I think I see where he's coming from and agree with what I think he may have meant. My ex-husband claims* to have been abused as a child. And it became his go to excuse for every awful thing he did, including physically attacking me repeatedly in increasingly brutal attacks, multiple fake suicide attempts and endangering our baby. Any time where he knew he had gone too far and it was possible that I wouldn't forgive him, he brought up being abused as a child.

When I did eventually separate from him and lay down the conditions he'd have to meet for us to have any hope of reconciliation, he used being abused as a child as a constant weapon against me, against my parents and against his own parents. I was honestly only able to leave him because of the danger he was posing to our baby. I gave him sooooooo much leeway because of being abused I'm not sure if I would ever have left him for my own sake. I was convinced he needed support and acceptance and his behaviour wasn't his fault. It wasn't until he went back off the deep-end towards the end of my pregnancy and in the first months of DS's life that I realised that he was using that abuse as an excuse. That he was unlikely to ever, ever stop his bad behaviour as long as he had this tool to absolve himself of all blame. So if it's that, which Fry was talking about, then. he needed to explain that better, but he's not wrong.

*I say claims, as while I believed him without question during our marriage and for years after, I'm less certain now for a number of reasons.

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