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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Which prison- Interesting press release

8 replies

UtterlyLostforwords · 11/11/2022 21:29

www.thamesvalley.police.uk/news/thames-valley/news/2022/october/31-10-2022/man-jailed-for-domestic-abuse--slough/

This article got me thinking about prisons and whether people
should always be put in the prison that corresponds with their birth sex (sorry not sure of correct terms here)? If a female decides they want to be a male, takes male hormones and/or has gener re-assignment surgery, Should that person be sent to a male or female prison? If the person, born female, poses a risk to women but would also be at risk from men if sent to a mens prison (i’m not sure how accepting male prisoners are) What would happen? Can prisoners ‘pick’ where they go?

OP posts:
Hoardasurass · 11/11/2022 22:17

The risk to a transman in a men's prison would be repeated gang rapes not lack of acceptance!
As for your question about what to do with a violent biological female (transman) prisoner who may or may not have taken testosterone and may or may not have had any surgery the answer is exactly the same as they would with any other violent biological female prisoner because that is what they are (regardless of how they identify).
My 1st point is the reason transmen aren't held in male prisons nor should they be.
As for can they swap as and when they wish don't know because transmen aren't put in the male estate. However there was a transwomen convicted murderer who got transferred to the female estate (really had to fight for it) who then went for parole only to find that the criteria for female murderers to get parole is much harsher than for males and tried to get transferred back to the male estate/parole system and was basically told by the court that they got what they asked for and now have to live with it 😆so highly unlikely that they can just say I don't like it here I want to change prison

JacquelinePot · 11/11/2022 22:21

Prisons are (or rather, should be) segregated by sex. Humans cannot change sex, however much they might wish to do so.

Women in women's prisons and men in men's prisons.

A dangerous or vulnerable female should be in the female estate. A dangerous or vulnerable male should be in the male estate.

That said, because the female population is many orders of magnitude smaller and the number of extremely violent females is so much lower, female prisons tend to be lower security and they aren't always equipped to handle such inmates in the female estate. I have read, but can't recall where, that these women can be housed in the male estate, but would be separate from the male population. Keep Prisons Single Sex will no doubt have lots of info on their site.

Ramblingnamechanger · 12/11/2022 08:58

Female violent offenders should still be placed in a womens prison. Why is she being referred to as a man? This is why we have to continue to fight against the ideology and speak the truth. No doubt her behaviour will be difficult to manage around other women, but pretending she is a man is not helpful. If she had aGRC it should make no difference. This is why the laws need sorting out so that identity does not trump sex.

Lysis · 12/11/2022 16:02

If a female offender is deemed too violent/dangerous to be held on the female estate, MOJ rules state that she should be held in a completely separate wing of a male prison - women's prisons just aren't set up to handle violent offenders. The fact that there are currently no female offenders in the male estate shows the difference between male and female offending. Even female serial killers are currently managed in the female estate.

The MOJ rules are from before prisons started being mixed sex: they simply reflect that women's prisons are set up differently to reflect the different type of offenders. If a transman is judged too dangerous for the female estate, presumably these rules with a separate wing would be followed as the risks to the transman would be too great in the male estate.

KevinJackson · 17/01/2023 14:51

This reply has been deleted

Unauthorised content. Deleted MNHQ

Circumferences · 17/01/2023 15:03

Well, I don't know, but (real) feminists have argued for many, many tired years, for the notion of a separate wing for transpeople in the prison of their actual sex. Transwomen would be kept in the separate wing in a man's prison and transmen (the ones on T, so more aggressive and stronger than women) and would be kept in the trans wing in the women's prison, for showering sleeping purposes etc, but would join their main prison for gym, learning, meals, screen time etc and social activities. So not "segregation" as TRA would argue. Only safety for women.
Non binary people would just go to the main prison according to their sex.

Seems reasonable.

The reason Karen White was able to sexually abuse four women and rape one while in a female prison was because they was sleeping in the same dorm as the women. KW may not have been so motivated to be sent to the women's prison if separate sleeping arrangements were involved.

Circumferences · 17/01/2023 15:51

Sorry that last para wasn't right. I meant

The reason Karen White was able to sexually abuse four women and rape one while in a female prison was because they was sleeping in the same dorm as the women.
KW may not have been so motivated to move to a trans wing of a male prison compared to moving into a woman's prison.

WallaceinAnderland · 17/01/2023 23:25

They should be separated by sex and dangerous people kept apart from main population.

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