It’s a Fair Cop (Radio 4)

[travellingfamily]

Anyone hear this tonight? It is the 6.30 comedy slot with a policeman taking the audience through a scenario and discussing possibilities.

Today he briefly discussed who should strip search a man who identifies as a woman. He specifically said that men will identify as a woman to be difficult and to use the only power they have.

He didn’t provide an answer but it was refreshing to hear it openly said that it is a problem, in a mainstream programme that was not about gender issues at all.

I really like Alfie Moore, good on him!

(And I didn't know there was a new series, so thank you )

yes, also delighted to be notified that there's a new series. I knew even before opening this up that Alfie Moore wouldn't be a dick about this. He's operated in the real world, he knows that men will take the piss, and aren't, in general, the most marginalised sector of society

I love Alfie Moore - brilliant series. So glad he didn’t disappoint.

Agree Alfie's brilliant. He is very very funny but there's always little nuggets that make you think embedded in his routines.

Very wise and humane man - interestingly, from the same force as PC "check your thinking" Gul. I wonder what Alfie thinks about that? I can guess

Linky
www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001cxhf

I was just coming here to see if anyone had spotted that! An excellent small example of how ‘being kind’ doesn’t always work.
He’s really good- there was one about flashing/exposure in an earlier series which he managed to make very funny while making sure no one thought the subject matter was funny at all.
On a lighter note did anyone hear the one with the vicar being harassed 😮

That’s great to hear. I heard last weeks episode where he spoke about mysoginists and also how women are being specifically “groomed” by gambling advertising and how disgraceful it is.

He’s seems very much one of the good guys.

I enjoyed that too OP (and yes, love Alfie Moore, Fair Cop is great, nicely observed, witty, wise and compassionate).

Yup, I spotted it too. Nice to hear things getting mentioned in comedy.
Now we just need all the TV comics to stun us by being brave.

I heard it and I'm afraid it annoyed me. He asked what do you do if a genuine sincere trans person wants to be searched by someone of their new gender (don't remember exact wording), and he & audience all agreed they should honour their wishes. Then he asked what do you do if big bearded dave who has never presented as anything but male does the same, just to be awkward, and that this will definitely start happening more.

So my questions were how can you tell the difference? What about the female police officer who has to do the search? What difference does the sincerity make to her? How can you draw up policy which honours the first without the second? The assumption was that there are genuine and non genuine cases (I agree as it happens). But the reality is that trans rights orgs have put alot of effort into making it transphobic to distinguish between the two.

I think I'm being harsh because it was good that he raised the problem. That in itself is quite a development.

He's really good. There's an old Fair Cop episode about a flasher and he is very firm about how it needs to be taken seriously.

What about the female police officer who has to do the search? What difference does the sincerity make to her? How can you draw up policy which honours the first without the second?

That.

The subjective experience inside a person's head makes zero difference to the objective experience of those around them. And it's been resoundingly proven that many will vigorously take the piss if this is an option on the 'good chap, will only ask if really genuinely necessary' front.

And no, there is no way to differentiate between sincerity and piss taking without Layla Moran to hand or Mr Spock for a mind meld.

So no. Sex based only.

Although I'm reminded of the TW who worked for the Labour Party, Madigan, who objected to being searched by a male security guard, but agreed if any of those obvious males had said the words 'I identify as a woman' that would have been absolutely fine.

So perhaps one of the police officers could kindly identify for a few minutes.

@Manderleyagain I completely agree with you that one shouldn't/can't distinguish between 'genuine' and 'non-genuine' self-id because the effect on the officer doing the searching is not really affected by the genuinely held beliefs of the prisoner.

However, I think what he was doing here was leading the audience up a path, and then gently leading them back by pointing out the problems. It was pretty similar to everything else he was saying, for example about the claustrophobia and the cells. He didn't do it perhaps as firmly as we might like, but I think that is what he was doing.

However, I think what he was doing here was leading the audience up a path, and then gently leading them back by pointing out the problems.
Yes I agree, which is why I think I was being harsh. He showed that there are problems, and maybe the audience will ask themselves those questions.

I'm also with travellingfamily. It's slow progress but we've gone from #nodebate, #bekind-or-be-a-bigot, from a few years ago, to someone on the BBC leading the audience to see that acceptance without exception can lead to a conflict of rights between transwomen and women.

I came here to comment on this show too.

Although there is a much bigger debate to have it was a good opener to show it it isn’t as simple as all that and that some men will do anything just to take the piss.