Mermaids vs LGB Alliance and Charity Commissioner - First-tier Tribunal (General Regulatory Chamber) Thread 3

[nauticant]

The Tribunal started on 9 September, witness testimony started on 12 September.

To obtain access to view the proceedings, send a request email to [email protected] about case CA/2021/0013 - Mermaids vs Charity Commissioner and LGB Alliance and ask for permission to join. You then have to provide certain information and agree to a judge's direction in order to be able to join.

There is also live tweeting from twitter.com/tribunaltweets.

Abbreviations:

J or judge: Presiding Judge, Judge Lynn Griffin
AJ or Judge: Assisted by Judge Joe Neville
MG: Mermaids counsel is Michael Gibbon KC
KM: LGB Alliance counsel is Karon Monaghan KC
AR: Karon is assisted by Akua Reindorf
IS: Charity Commission counsel is Iain Steele

(Also the witnesses, PR: Paul Roberts, JN: John Nicolson. BB: Belinda Bell, BJ: Beverley Jackson, KH: Kate Harris, and EG: Eileen Gallagher.)

Thread 1: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4629679-mermaids-versus-lgb-alliance-in-court-today
Thread 2: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4632780-mermaids-vs-lgb-alliance-and-charity-commissioner-first-tier-tribunal-general-regulatory-chameber-thread-2
Thread 3: ongoing

Witnesses for the applicant (Mermaids):

Paul Roberts - CEO of LGBT Consortium (12 September)
John Nicolson MP - Deputy Chair of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Global LGBT+ Rights (13 September)
Dr Belinda Bell - Chair of trustees of Mermaids (13 September)

Witnesses for the respondent (LGB Alliance):

Beverley Jackson - Co-founder and trustee of LGB Alliance (13-14 September)
Kate Harris - Co-founder and trustee of LGB Alliance (14-15 September)
Eileen Gallagher OBE - Chair of trustees of LGB Alliance (15 September)

Witness Statements:

Paul Roberts: lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Paul-Roberts-Witness-Statement-Exhibits.pdf
John Nicolson MP - lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/John-Nicolson-Witness-Statement-Exhibits.pdf
Dr Belinda Bell: lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Belinda-Bell-Witness-Statement-Exhibits.pdf
Beverley Jackson: lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Bev-Jackson-Witness-Statement-Exhibits-1.pdf
Kate Harris: lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Kate-Harris-Witness-Statement-Exhibits.pdf
Eileen Gallagher (two statements): lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Eileen-Gallagher-Witness-Statement-Exhibits.pdf lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Eileen-Gallagher-Second-Witness-Statement-Exhibits.pdf

Submissions:

lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Volume-4-Submissions-CA.2021.0013.pdf

(Header format follows the gold standard established by @ickky)

post updated by MNHQ at OP's request

MG- you are not neutral,are you?
KH- our starting position is there are two sexes. I would say that is scientific, reasonable and evidence based.

KH - ideology like Japanese knotweed

Yes, indeed

Gender ideology = Japanese knotweed.

Yup.

Good emphasis on safeguarding from KH

Oh KH you made me cry with your clarity and your clear stance on what a lesbian is and why that matters.

I don't understand - why do they have to be neutral? Yesterday Bev pointed out that there are pro-choice charities and pro-life ones, and both are allowed and able to exist. Why does he think they need to be neutral? Stonewall and Mermaids aren't neutral on it?

KH- Since started up an awful lot of light shone on this ideology which was deliberately kept in the shadows. Parents are asking questions now.

KH - clearly stating that we must examine what is happening

KH- It is a global phenomenon and it particularly affects girls.

He's trying to prove their point that LGBA have a 'hidden agenda' and that's why they haven't used the term 'gender critical'

She mentioned Fausto Sterling and questioning of GI. Does anyone know what that is about?

How can you bring up children teaching them that they must not lie, it's one of the worst things they could do and then telling them that this lie okay and you must repeat it?

How do you square that circle?

KH- Similar kind of madness as the south sea bubble. Massive over correction. People falling for a myth.

Comparing madness of gender ideology to South Sea Bubble now. I think I love her.

Surely it hasn't just been said, in court, that stating that 'you cannot change sex' is political. * *

On Tribunal Tweets - what is SE/ SSE? I assume Same-sex orientation or similar?

e.g. "KH: don't agree. Gave responses following petition. Objects were based on SW, well known for last 30 years and we thought most ppl would understand SSE based on biology. Using language on EA"

MG: other ppl have different understanding of SE and lesbian?

Thanks Crabby.

Single sex exemptions, maybe?

This mobile.twitter.com/TwisterFilm/status/1569018011876741120?cxt=HHwWgMDSwbPkosYrAAAA

Thank you :)

KH- I cannot tolerate dishonesty. I am sorry if it is offensive to some but it is a lie to tell a child you could have been born in the wrong body.
Adults can make up their own minds. We believe in freedom of expression. But we are concerned about children.

Paul Roberts from Mermaids.

PR = Paul Roberts - CEO of LGBT Consortium

"MG: clarify. I said lied to and u say they believed. Can't be a lie if they believ
KH: can't it?"

Really? Someone who works in law says something cannot be a lie if people believe it? I'm going to assume he didn't actually say that...

Oh just realised I misunderstood - if the people saying it believe it even if it's not true, it can't be a lie. Debatable.