Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

How to challenge drag queen story time

69 replies

Sorcha69 · 26/05/2022 20:21

My local library is going to be doing this and I would like some pointers on how to challenge this.
How have others approached this?
Thanks

OP posts:
Citylady88 · 28/05/2022 14:00

The money for library events including drag queen story times will not be coming from the book budget. Some authors do actually get paid for appearances, and sometimes events are completely funded externally or by partner organisations or by friends of groups etc. There are also a wide range of people who tell stories in libraries- as mentioned by pp yes fire fighters and wheelchair users and various other people from the community do tell stories in libraries. It doesn't get noticed because people just jump on the band wagon of hating drag queens.

Musomama1 · 28/05/2022 14:04

I think it's £150 per visit, which makes £450 for 3 visits. I work in ents, £150 is the going rate for a one person show at a 'venue' like this.

My issue is not so much womanface, it's the fact drag represents adult entertainment, and some of it pretty seedy - Krystal Lubrikunt anyone? Literally got no problem with drag in it's right place. I think there's a tenuous at best diversity link simply because many people who are LGBT do it. I think it represents LGBT as much as female strippers represent women.

I think the bookers ought to get out more tbh, they don't really understand the scene. Having worked alongside children's entertainment in some big name venues over 15+ years this would never get booked (she says...).

Jadedandlost · 28/05/2022 14:04

lookforthesun · 28/05/2022 09:20

Hello,
I was dismayed to see that you are supporting and hosting a drag queen in the library. In an era where we are meant to be progressively breaking down stereotypes - this damaging and offensive parody of women is out-dated and unacceptable.

Blackface/brownface/yellowface is rightly condemned. Many people feel the same about "womenface" or men dressing up in women's clothing purely to demonstrate sexist stereotypes for a laugh. It is equivalent to cultural appropriation or the way in which white people have mocked black people, Asian people, Indigenous people, and pretty much every other race/ethnicity that isn’t theirs, under the guise of “performance” or “satire.” Why is it funny or entertaining for men to mock women via drag?

This is not about transgender or LBTQ rights.
Drag queens are not women, nor do they purport to be women. The very definition of a drag queen is a man parodying a woman.
It is a man turning women into extreme, cartoonish caricatures that are to be mocked. There is a reason women don’t do this to men — and that is society doesn’t see men or masculinity as something amusing or to be joked about.

I am fully behind libraries supporting gay/lesbian rights etc but to host a drag event is a regressive, offensive act.
Drag does not belong in 2022 and a public library is not the place for men to ridicule, mock, and appropriate femininity. I hope you will reconsider the message about women that you want to send to the local children. We can do better than to promote sexist stereotypes and ridicule of women in the name of entertainment.

Kind regards

This is brilliant. I’m going to memorise it.

Holly60 · 28/05/2022 14:09

I suggest you make your distaste crystal clear by boycotting the whole event.

Holly60 · 28/05/2022 14:10

Everyone will thank you for it, for sure.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 28/05/2022 14:10

Citylady88 · 28/05/2022 14:00

The money for library events including drag queen story times will not be coming from the book budget. Some authors do actually get paid for appearances, and sometimes events are completely funded externally or by partner organisations or by friends of groups etc. There are also a wide range of people who tell stories in libraries- as mentioned by pp yes fire fighters and wheelchair users and various other people from the community do tell stories in libraries. It doesn't get noticed because people just jump on the band wagon of hating drag queens.

No of course it won't be coming from the book budget. It will be coming from a different library budget (community engagement or something) and if this is what they're going to spend it on, it would be better to reallocate it to books. Or the fuel bill.

Maybe they don't have austerity measures in Bristol or something...

MangyInseam · 28/05/2022 14:15

lanadelgrey · 28/05/2022 13:29

If I had time or energy then I’d be creating an organisation to provide storytimes for children in libraries and then recruit all sorts of people, firefighters, wheelchair users, the local imam/rabbi, grandparents, wheelchair users, charity types, business people, the Lord Mayor. And also to go into schools etc so relevant to every characteristic. Just an idea? There will be earmarked budgets for diversity initiatives which the current offering and some good marketing has tapped into.

I feel badly for children. They can't just go to the library and hear a story. There always has to be messaging attached.

kimberly489 · 28/05/2022 16:24

FeminismAndCake · 27/05/2022 08:24

If your area has any diversity of population I would point out the indirect discrimination in how this event alienates and excludes Muslim populations.

How does it alienate Muslims?

Shakeupandwakeup · 28/05/2022 16:48

I feel badly for children. They can't just go to the library and hear a story. There always has to be messaging attached.

Yep. Radical idea. Let's get people into libraries to read to children because they are good at reading aloud and bring the characters to life and don't need their own egos massaging or need to draw attention to themselves by declaring how they will dress for story time because it isn't about them.

Sorcha69 · 28/05/2022 17:06

BanjoVio · 28/05/2022 11:05

Sorry, I don’t see the issue. What’s wrong with drag queens? Sounds like fun to me.

Fun? His instragram reveals the following
Transgender women ( ie men)who like women are lesbians.
Puberty blockers for children are celebrated
Transgender women in female sport is applauded
Jk Rowling is a terf for supporting rights for woman.

His safeguarding policy...available on his website does not state correctly the protected characteristics as per the gender equality act...gender identity is there even though it is not actually a protected characteristic..guess whats missing?

There is no thought hone into the safeguarding policy..it basically states do not have sex with people under 18.

OP posts:
Sorcha69 · 28/05/2022 17:17

lookforthesun · 28/05/2022 09:20

Hello,
I was dismayed to see that you are supporting and hosting a drag queen in the library. In an era where we are meant to be progressively breaking down stereotypes - this damaging and offensive parody of women is out-dated and unacceptable.

Blackface/brownface/yellowface is rightly condemned. Many people feel the same about "womenface" or men dressing up in women's clothing purely to demonstrate sexist stereotypes for a laugh. It is equivalent to cultural appropriation or the way in which white people have mocked black people, Asian people, Indigenous people, and pretty much every other race/ethnicity that isn’t theirs, under the guise of “performance” or “satire.” Why is it funny or entertaining for men to mock women via drag?

This is not about transgender or LBTQ rights.
Drag queens are not women, nor do they purport to be women. The very definition of a drag queen is a man parodying a woman.
It is a man turning women into extreme, cartoonish caricatures that are to be mocked. There is a reason women don’t do this to men — and that is society doesn’t see men or masculinity as something amusing or to be joked about.

I am fully behind libraries supporting gay/lesbian rights etc but to host a drag event is a regressive, offensive act.
Drag does not belong in 2022 and a public library is not the place for men to ridicule, mock, and appropriate femininity. I hope you will reconsider the message about women that you want to send to the local children. We can do better than to promote sexist stereotypes and ridicule of women in the name of entertainment.

Kind regards

Thank you..I will use this as the basis for my complaint if thats ok

OP posts:
Abitofalark · 28/05/2022 17:47

As I see it, the primary objection here must be that it is unsuitable for children because it is a sexualised and sex-preoccupied adult form and performance; that it is offensively using women is undoubtedly another objectionable aspect but I would not flag that as the main concern where it is targeted at children.

MangyInseam · 28/05/2022 18:07

If you really want to make an argument, I think there are a few points:

a) Drag, as a form of entertainment or maybe even as an art form on accasion, is about how gay male sexuality interacts with social presentation and culture. As such, even when very intelligently done, it's not intellectually accessible to, nor is it of interest to, children.

b) Becase of point a, it's often going to involve very sexualized costumes, jokes, and context, which are not appropriate for children. All the more so because they can't interpret their meaning accurately.

c) Despite some attempts by people like RuPaul to sanitize drag for corporate purposes, it is mainly something that takes place in environments highly unsuitable for children. That is, clubs where there are a lot of drgs and a lot of very sexalized behaviour.

d) Typically the excuse for these kinds of events, from the POV of library and school organizations, is that it serves their DEI initiatives. These are very powerful directives that come down from above which say schools have to spend a certain amount of time promoting certain ideas. Of course it is meant to be done in an age appropriate way that will capture kids' interest. Libraries struggle with how to bring sexuality diversity to their childrens programming and having kids colour flags, or these storytimes, is what they come up with.

It either doesn't occur to the actual organizers - or they feel they can't question - that when it comes down to it, you probably just don't need to be pushing queer activism on the storytime set (or maybe any activism.) Nor does it occur that drag and flags etc doesn't mean much to the vast majority of gay people who may in fact dislike all of that and are just normal people who act and look like everyone else and don't feel the need to talk to other people's children about sex.

So when challenging these things, it's maybe worthwhile to keep that background in mind, because these organizations are often desperate to fulfill these programming obligations they've been given.

nepeta · 28/05/2022 18:27

Perhaps we should demand equal ridicule of the male sex? Why only have one sex exposed for ridicule, and that one the sex which got the vote much later than the other sex etc.? Why should small children learn that making fun of women is fine, but that making fun of men is not?

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 28/05/2022 19:18

kimberly489 · 28/05/2022 16:24

How does it alienate Muslims?

Observant Muslims of both sexes are obliged to dress modestly, and I think such a religious tenet may mean that they are reluctant to take their child to see a performer whose costume is so skintight that on past library visits, the outline of his penis was visible.More pictures like this on his facebook account.

How to challenge drag queen story time
PurgatoryOfPotholes · 28/05/2022 19:22

kimberly489 · 28/05/2022 16:24

How does it alienate Muslims?

Observant muslims of both sexes are obliged to dress modestly, and I think such a religious tenet may mean that they are reluctant to take their child to see a performer whose costume is so skintight that on past library visits, that the outline of his penis was visible.

I'm an atheist and I'm not willing to go!

Lots more pictures like this on his official business facebook account, btw.

How to challenge drag queen story time
kimberly489 · 29/05/2022 11:33

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 28/05/2022 19:22

Observant muslims of both sexes are obliged to dress modestly, and I think such a religious tenet may mean that they are reluctant to take their child to see a performer whose costume is so skintight that on past library visits, that the outline of his penis was visible.

I'm an atheist and I'm not willing to go!

Lots more pictures like this on his official business facebook account, btw.

Yeah that's a bit vile 🤢

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 29/05/2022 16:41

I don't know what any of the people involved in this are thinking. Are they thinking, at all?

Sorcha69 · 29/05/2022 18:35

@Shakeupandwakeup it's 450 for 3 sessions ( different libraries) where did you see claims about child porn?

OP posts:
Sorcha69 · 29/05/2022 18:36

@PurgatoryOfPotholes it's a tick box exercise..inclusion , diversity,

What's not a tick box is safeguarding

OP posts:
Slothtoes · 12/06/2024 11:27

Local libraries have been decimated by Tory cuts to local government funding since 2010.
All libraries need public footfall to keep themselves open and so they are therefore desperate for any subsidised or funded events.

However I am concerned to see that the publicly funded UK Arts council has funded drag queens to do story sessions in libraries for kids in 2024, despite recent years of objections to parents about these.

Surely the Arts council and local libraries should know by now that this is inappropriate means of personal and political expression for young kids? At best it’s pointless and they don’t understand it, at worst it’s giving misogynistic and sexualised messages.

I notice the library is describing the performer as a ‘pantomime dame’ and is avoiding using the term drag queen in the blurb. But the picture is of the performer in a rainbow outfit, so it’s clearly not about a man dressing up as Widow Twankey to read to kids. (Which I don’t like either as a parody of women but maybe that’s for another thread).

I notice there isn’t a taxpayer funded tour of ‘Buttons Story Time’ or ‘pantomime Principal Boy Story Time’ because they want to give other panto characters work over the summer. They’ve just changed the label. Why do that if it’s all fine? Why is it so important to get this type of male performance in front of small kids? Why are we all subsiding it?

Slothtoes · 12/06/2024 11:27

Subsidising!

FrancescaContini · 12/06/2024 13:28

Brilliant letter @lookforthesun

In addition to all the objections listed above, this person’s name itself should be raising a few eyebrows amongst library staff: it’s obviously a “play” on ADHD. Not funny.

Christinapple · 12/06/2024 13:33

Sorcha69 · 26/05/2022 20:21

My local library is going to be doing this and I would like some pointers on how to challenge this.
How have others approached this?
Thanks

Could I please suggest you don't? There are a lot of violent threats made on twitter and violence carried out in person towards them.

FrancescaContini · 12/06/2024 13:36

Towards who? The libraries 🤷‍♀️??