Children’s minister not ‘overly happy’ for transgender girls to board with his daughters

[zanahoria]

The children’s minister has said he would not be “overly happy” with his daughters sharing a boarding house with transgender girls.

Will Quince, minister for children and families, described the issue of trans pupils in single sex spaces as “a bit of a minefield”.

He said the "number one priority" of schools should be the safeguarding of pupils.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/03/01/childrens-minister-not-overly-happy-transgender-girls-board/

“Not overly happy” = not on your fucking nelly

“It’s a minefield” = I am going to make it look as if I am sitting on the fence - but the first statement makes clear that I DO have an opinion on the subject, especially where my own daughter is concerned

He’s my MP. I’ve written to him and informed him. He wrote back after my first lengthy letter to say “don’t worry we are improving funding for LGBT issues” ! He’s ignored every letter since.

Maybe part of the 'improving funding' could be third spaces for those who want mixed-sex, with single-sex facilities for those who don't.

It's not a fucking minefield, it's perfectly simple. Nothing has changed in regards to humans being either male or female. Nothing. 'Gender' is meaningless bollocks.

The ONLY way to safeguard female pupils is to keep things single sex. I give no shits about any male who thinks their subjective feelings entitle them to access female spaces.

Not one of the female teens I know claiming to be trans or non binary ever use the men's/boy's facilities. Funny that.

This is the consequence of his government cosying up to all the child safeguarding breaching lobby groups. Until they start challenging those insisting on males having access to women and girls when vulnerable, undressing, showering sleeping etc then he's in the same position as all parents trying to safeguard their children. Worrying whether schools have secure safeguarding policies or whether they've been captured by groups promoting behaviour dangerous to girls

@Toseland

He’s my MP. I’ve written to him and informed him. He wrote back after my first lengthy letter to say “don’t worry we are improving funding for LGBT issues” ! He’s ignored every letter since.

Maybe it makes a difference when the women and children affected are 'his'.

It seems he would have continued evading the issue without being put on the spot by Caroline Johnson, Conservative MP and consultant paediatrician.

Maybe it makes a difference when the women and children affected are 'his'.

I suspect that would be the case with most of the TWAW brigade tbh. But then I did just have a flashback to that MP feeding his daughter a burger at the height of the CJD scare...

I suppose it is a minefield in the sense that if you say anything about it you might find it blows up in your face.

But it sounds like he knows that when push comes to shove it's not on.

'He said the "number one priority" of schools should be the safeguarding of pupils'

A good start.

This is good. "It's a minefield" is cowardly but it's better than that handwringing "ooh it's so complicated" bollocks that cowards usually come out with. It's not remotely complicated but it is a minefield, because Stonewall and Pink News and a bunch of weirdos on Twitter will get very angry with anyone who has anything sane or coherent to say on the topic.

And indicating that he, personally wouldn't like his daughter to share a room with "trans girls" seems like a big step forward. Usually no one dares to have any personal opinions on this subject other than going on about how lovely the TW they personally know are.

Maybe he's learned and grown since pp wrote to him? Or at least, maybe he's figured out what way the wind is blowing.

And indicating that he, personally wouldn't like his daughter to share a room with "trans girls" seems like a big step forward. Usually no one dares to have any personal opinions on this subject

adding: I know he was asked the question but he's a politician! He could have dodged it, I think dodging questions must be the first thing politicians learn in media training. He must have decided to give a real answer. And if he's a pathetic ass-covering coward, that's brilliant because it means that even pathetic ass-covering cowards are starting to oppose the TRA.

But does he mean safeguarding female children or trans-identifying children? Who takes priority? Because it doesn’t appear that females are given a second thought usually…

Loving the Guardian headline implying it was 'trans children' he wasn't keen on eing with his daughters rather than a male 18 year old. Disingenuous bustards (yes I do subscribe).

Will Quince is copied on this complaint to CAFCASS, which seeks an urgent review of the governance of CAFCASS arising from - as EBSW say/allege - is the adoption of ideology putting children (girls in particular) at risk:

www.ebswa.org/post/questions-for-cafcass

It's only a minefield if you're too chicken shit to agree that they're either in or out. As choices go, it's pretty binary.

But yes, him even acknowledging that trans girls are the opposite sex to his daughters is a forward step.

I really wonder what would happen if girls started demanding they share dormitories with boys. Ten boys and one girl looks different to ten girls and one boy. And you'd have to start unpicking all the reasons why.

Also in the Times today
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/childrens-minister-will-quinces-unease-at-trans-pupils-in-dorms-j0hh8phbj

and Standard yesterday (no paywall)
www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/children-department-for-education-jamie-oliver-b985346.html

A clear statement from a Minister that safeguarding children should always take priority is very welcome.

It's not clear whether the children in question are in fact sharing a bedroom, or sleeping in separate bedrooms in the same girls' boarding house. Obviously both of these scenarios raise issues, but perhaps not quite the same ones.

If you're concerned by this, you should be aware that schools in many areas may be following guidance that tells them that they should offer mixed-sex sleeping accommodation on school trips if that's what trans children say they want. There haven't been very many school residential trips for the last couple of years, for obvious reasons, so schools are only now having to deal with the practical challenges of this guidance.

If you have school age children I strongly encourage you to contact your child's school now and find out what their approach is going to be. Don't wait until you have to deal with a specific scenario. These articles might offer you a useful reason to raise the issue now.

This approach raises significant safeguarding risks for all children, including trans children. @Datun I think trans boys saying they want to share a bedroom with boys is absolutely a foreseeable scenario, and it's very worrying to me that schools/parents will continue to be too scared to say 'No, this is not appropriate'.

The DfE the Equalities Office, and the EHRC, are all 'working towards guidance'. Taking ages, innit.

The 'minefield' is trying to say it without saying it. It's tricky issuing guidance where the most salient, relevant bit is the part you're not supposed to say out loud.

I have a hunch it's going be one of the biggest buck passing pieces of guidance ever issued.

I'll be bloody shocked if any of it actually acknowledges that safeguarding is compromised with mixed sex accommodation.

There'll a lot of 'balancing rights' and 'keeping everyone safe', though.

Datun I think trans boys saying they want to share a bedroom with boys is absolutely a foreseeable scenario, and it's very worrying to me that schools/parents will continue to be too scared to say 'No, this is not appropriate'.

I think it's going to happen, too. The politicising of the issue will force it.

I hope it's not naivete, but I genuinely think that more people would baulk at putting girls in a room full of boys, than the other way around.

And certainly in prep schools, I don't think it's individual rooms in many of them? And the oldest children will be 13.

It's only a minefield if you're too chicken shit to agree that they're either in or out. As choices go, it's pretty binary

And as a minister and as a parent he has to make those choices

I don't really know about boarding schools, but I think twin rooms and single rooms are pretty common for the older children?

How would parents feel about a sixth-form age girl and trans girl sharing a twin room? What about if they're in a relationship? Or if they've been sharing a dormitory already for years because no-one thought it was quite such a big deal when they were younger/it was a bigger group?

It's not clear whether the children in question are in fact sharing a bedroom, or sleeping in separate bedrooms in the same girls' boarding house. Obviously both of these scenarios raise issues, but perhaps not quite the same ones.

I'm guessing from the Mermaids comment in the Standard article that this is about a girls' school, and a boy who identifies as a trans girl wants to be admitted to the school.

Mermaids comment: "The small number of schools that are using financial resources and staff time to organise a blanket ban on trans pupils attending single sex schools is really sad and perplexing".

Are trans pupils really excluded from single sex schools of their sex ?

Girls Day Schools Trust - which is a group of private girls schools have recently reviewed their policy on this and stated that they remain single sex and won't admit trans girls. So yes, boys are being excluded from girls schools regardless of their gender.