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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

EHRC says no case for GRA reform re Scottish gov

271 replies

WarriorN · 26/01/2022 15:46

According to fair play for women.

Awaiting confirmation via a link

EHRC says no case for GRA reform re Scottish gov
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WarriorN · 29/01/2022 09:18

Pure DARVO.

At least the police then later agreed it was shit

OP posts:
KittenKong · 29/01/2022 09:25

Who is the bloke in the middle photo? Does the article mention him (I must’ve missed it)?

IvyTwines · 29/01/2022 09:27

God, I didn't know that the chair of the EHRC from 2015 to 2020 had been the chair of Stonewall from 2003-2012!

KittenKong · 29/01/2022 09:28

Well colour me shocked and call me Betty… lots of people do seem to pop up don’t they?

Datun · 29/01/2022 09:30

In September Murray posted a message on social media on behalf of Brodie’s Trust saying: “Due to deeply concerning comments made by the current CEO of ERCC we have taken the decision to no longer signpost to this service. We cannot in all conscience send vulnerable women to the service in its current state.” The message continued: “We have no interest in our clients’ religion, sexuality nor political views . . . We are a women-only service run by women for women and will not be intimidated into changing our stance on this matter.”

Detectives from Edinburgh arrived at her door on November 4. Murray said: “I ushered them through to the living room. The first thing they said was, ‘Some of your tweets have been brought to our attention.’ When they brought out the screengrabs of the statement, I said, ‘Really?’
“They said, ‘Yeah, we just have to speak to you. You’ve not said anything hateful, there isn’t a crime here.’
“I said: ‘So why are you here?’ They said, ‘Because we need to speak to you to ascertain what your thinking was behind making your statement.’

Fucking hell.

It's actually worse than the PC Gul debacle.

Police officers fully admitting there's no crime, no hate, nothing. But are checking 'thoughts' anyway.

Actual Thought Police. Open and blatant.

Datun · 29/01/2022 09:32

@KittenKong

Who is the bloke in the middle photo? Does the article mention him (I must’ve missed it)?
I think they might be the thought police entering her house. The article mentioned a photograph.
KittenKong · 29/01/2022 09:41

So not an officer - a detective? Wow - he joined the force thinking he was going to be a real policeman catching murderers and this is what he ends up doing.

YouSetTheTone · 29/01/2022 09:46

@Datun

In September Murray posted a message on social media on behalf of Brodie’s Trust saying: “Due to deeply concerning comments made by the current CEO of ERCC we have taken the decision to no longer signpost to this service. We cannot in all conscience send vulnerable women to the service in its current state.” The message continued: “We have no interest in our clients’ religion, sexuality nor political views . . . We are a women-only service run by women for women and will not be intimidated into changing our stance on this matter.”

Detectives from Edinburgh arrived at her door on November 4. Murray said: “I ushered them through to the living room. The first thing they said was, ‘Some of your tweets have been brought to our attention.’ When they brought out the screengrabs of the statement, I said, ‘Really?’
“They said, ‘Yeah, we just have to speak to you. You’ve not said anything hateful, there isn’t a crime here.’
“I said: ‘So why are you here?’ They said, ‘Because we need to speak to you to ascertain what your thinking was behind making your statement.’

Fucking hell.

It's actually worse than the PC Gul debacle.

Police officers fully admitting there's no crime, no hate, nothing. But are checking 'thoughts' anyway.

Actual Thought Police. Open and blatant.

Fucking hell. That quote. This is unbelievable. I don’t have access to the article, even via share token, as my Times subscription has lapsed. But who was instructing the police to make that visit? I find it hard to believe they did that off their own back?
EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 29/01/2022 09:58

Actual Thought Police. Open and blatant.

As PPs say, this can not be why these people signed up for the Police Service.

Datun · 29/01/2022 10:02

It's even worse. Even they don't believe what they're doing, but they're doing it anyway.

Murray said: “Then they said, ‘We better watch what we are saying — we don’t want to be quoted as police officers saying such and such.’
“I said, ‘Don’t worry about that. It is insanity, isn’t it?’ They said, ‘It is.’ They wished me well and went away.

The police themselves are intimidated into doing something they don't think is right.

At least PC Gul had been on a bloody course which made him think Freaky Friday was real.

Clymene · 29/01/2022 10:11

Here's a share token:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/b14bcfe6-8092-11ec-8532-85a58274df7c?shareToken=8bc55ba2bf4a83e52202322de4336654

I am gobsmacked by this. Yes we think this is mad but we're in Scotland where a ribbon can get you into trouble with the law.

Honestly never want to go to Scotland ever again.

WarriorN · 29/01/2022 10:12

@YouSetTheTone there's an archive link above.

The reporting to the police and the police actually turning up and "checking thinking" is beyond unbelievable. the reporting is the actions of some seriously worrying individual/s.

This is pure DARVO.

Who the fuck sanctioned the visit?

It then says;

“I said: ‘So why are you here?’ They said, ‘Because we need to speak to you to ascertain what your thinking was behind making your statement.’

“I said, ‘Protecting women and letting them know that when they come to us they have a woman-only space, and we won’t let anyone in who won’t maintain that.’”

Murray said: “Then they said, ‘We better watch what we are saying — we don’t want to be quoted as police officers saying such and such.’

“I said, ‘Don’t worry about that. It is insanity, isn’t it?’

They said, ‘It is.’ They wished me well and went away."

So the officers themselves recognised the insanity.

They shouldn't have been there in the first place.

This does happen regularly to victims of domestic abuse; the perpetrators use the police. It happened to my friend only a few weeks ago. Luckily she was able to use the police visit to report the years of coercive abuse for the first time as it was plainly obvious to all concerned that she wasn't harassing her very well off ex with ONE email about non payment of maintenance.

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GoatsareGOAT · 29/01/2022 10:14

They also travelled from Edinburgh to Perth which is at least a 3 hour round trip. Confused

WarriorN · 29/01/2022 10:18

It's even worse. Even they don't believe what they're doing, but they're doing it anyway.

Cross post, yes.

The impact on my friend, as I'm sure on Murray was huge. My friend immediately though someone had died. And then to be told they were investigating her for harassment of her ex with her children in the house was horrific.

This was her ex abusing her. Someone targeted Murray just as someone did to Jenni.

The police are able to say "lovely carry on" to TRAs using stickers threatening guns violence but they come and check the thinking of women who run / support charities for vulnerable women?!

Dr Konstancja Duff has apparently written a book on police abolishment which, while at first hear sounds extreme, I'm starting to think I might read.

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KittenKong · 29/01/2022 10:24

@GoatsareGOAT

They also travelled from Edinburgh to Perth which is at least a 3 hour round trip. Confused
Does that mean that this is where the complaint was made?
BernardBlackMissesLangCleg · 29/01/2022 10:25

the last line of that article:

In a statement the Scottish Police Federation said: “QED.”

what the fuck does that even mean?

Nicola Murray is able to tell that Mridul Wadhwa is a man (and a pretty sexist one at that), so it transphobic?

Men shouldn't be running services for vulnerable women?

what?

Datun · 29/01/2022 10:31

“I said, ‘Protecting women and letting them know that when they come to us they have a woman-only space, and we won’t let anyone in who won’t maintain that.’”

They wished her well and went away.

So what if she had said something different? Was she only left alone because she didn't mention trans ideology?

WarriorN · 29/01/2022 10:32

Does that mean that this is where the complaint was made?

As her original statement severs ties with Rape Crisis Edinburgh, I imagine yes?

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KittenKong · 29/01/2022 10:33

@Datun

“I said, ‘Protecting women and letting them know that when they come to us they have a woman-only space, and we won’t let anyone in who won’t maintain that.’”

They wished her well and went away.

So what if she had said something different? Was she only left alone because she didn't mention trans ideology?

comments like that are viewed as anti trans though. It’s all about it.
WarriorN · 29/01/2022 10:33

@Datun

“I said, ‘Protecting women and letting them know that when they come to us they have a woman-only space, and we won’t let anyone in who won’t maintain that.’”

They wished her well and went away.

So what if she had said something different? Was she only left alone because she didn't mention trans ideology?

They need a word with Newport police then. Not using the T word still led to Jenni's arrest.

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EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 29/01/2022 10:38

@IvyTwines

God, I didn't know that the chair of the EHRC from 2015 to 2020 had been the chair of Stonewall from 2003-2012!
The harms that flow from all of these interconnections. I have to make a DOI (declaration of interest) in writing and verbally for every meeting I attend and the organisations involve have to determine whether it's a COI (conflict of interest).

Move from Chair of Stonewall to Chair of EHRC, no problem.

Bosky · 29/01/2022 11:05

YouSetTheTone - You don't need a subscription to read an article with a share token link.

That's what share tokens are for, ie. for reading without a subscription:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/b14bcfe6-8092-11ec-8532-85a58274df7c?shareToken=e250135a7d312e2f04db8d99f0e79b8e

Bosky · 29/01/2022 11:08

This latest fiasco has its own thread. Good idea as it will get buried in here:

Police interview Nicola Murray

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4466679-Police-interview-Nicola-Murray

YouSetTheTone · 29/01/2022 11:37

Thanks to those who have tried to share the article with me.

I think I’m going to have to try using a lap top because even when I use a share token link on my phone the article won’t load. It just goes to my The Times app where the subscription info is displayed - it’s like it’s locking me out until I have a subscription again. It’s weird because share tokens worked for me on my phone before I subscribed.

GibbonsGoatsGibbons · 29/01/2022 11:51

YouSetTheTone have you tried pasting the link into an incognito/private page?

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