Getting out of the sex and gender category.

[WandaWomblesaurus73]

We have a couple of threads now outside of ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶w̶a̶l̶l̶s̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶H̶o̶g̶w̶a̶r̶t̶s̶ the sex and gender category. Every single woman I know across all different backgrounds are getting sick of the abuse now - I do think women are wanting to engage and talk more.

I think this is positive and it's important that all women can talk - and know they can talk.

Waving to you ladies on Gransnet too!

Took me a minute to work out what you meant - but this is good news - you mean that the nonsense and harm that is gender identity ideology is being discussed elsewhere on MN? Specifically GransNet?

Can you link to the thread(s)?

I realised things had started to change when my book group started discussing gender issues at our last meeting in December (and I hadn't raised it myself). Turns out we had all been feeling a bit too scared to talk about it as one of our members has a DC who is transitioning, but we managed to have a really productive and honest discussion, it was such a relief.

This has cheered me up!

And I don't often post here, but it's the board I read most.

It is all quite cheering isn’t it.

Here’s a thread in AIBU, which I’m hoping will open the eyes of a few www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4448106-To-be-saddened-and-yet-also-angry-that-the-Harry-Potter-20th-Anniversary-Reunion-show-totally-blanked-JK-Rowling?pg=5

It's been brilliant because if any of the FWR regulars start a thread on AIBU or similar in order to raise awareness generally, there's an immediate call to 'go back to your own board - no-one wants to hear that here' but those who are starting these threads or posting comments are not FWR regulars and it's clear that more and more people are starting to think 'hold up, what's going on?'

There's also more and more new names I am noticing popping up on threads here with some great comments. Women are getting angry.

@Waitwhat23

It's been brilliant because if any of the FWR regulars start a thread on AIBU or similar in order to raise awareness generally, there's an immediate call to 'go back to your own board - no-one wants to hear that here' but those who are starting these threads or posting comments are not FWR regulars and it's clear that more and more people are starting to think 'hold up, what's going on?'

There's also more and more new names I am noticing popping up on threads here with some great comments. Women are getting angry.

I love seeing all the less familiar names weighing in

The resistance I has really got some momentum now, and women are pissed off at being told what we are and what we think.

Can't link them from the app but there is one about Drag And another one I started about Predators being reported as women in the media that has gone on to keeping womens prisons single sex.

I think we need to be a little careful cross-linking from this board to others. I did it the other day on the prison thread, and afterwards thought that maybe I hadn't.

My fear is that it leads to (a) accusations of pile ins along the lines of "you headed over for reinforcements"; and more importantly (b) fears that the regular monitors on FWR will have their attention drawn to the threads elsewhere and mass report them.

Threads outside FWR are beginning to speak for themselves - there is pretty much no support for self-id, lots of support for single sex spaces, a fair amount of horror at what is going on with children, and a general waking up to the wider picture. I hate it when threads out there get moved to the naughty corner simply because some vindictive over-enthusiastic watcher demands it.

I had a really positive conversation with one of my TWAW friends over Christmas. She’s a primary school teacher and I asked her how she managed to juggle teaching that your “gender” isn't defined by how you outwardly express yourself I.e girls can be fire fighters and play with Lego and boys can be nurses and play with dolls etc. with the idea that some girls are actually boys and some boys are actually girls because of how they outwardly express themselves e.g a boy who likes paying with dolls.

I followed this up with “and how are five year olds supposed to reconcile those two opposing ideas? Because I know I can’t”

She just blinked at me, looked a little green around the gills, and said “I see your point”

I've also noticed that threads in AIBU often get moved when a few "FWR regulars" post and I think the monitors are advance searching regulars and then reporting threads they are on elsewhere.

Sometimes I notice a fantastically knowledgeable post from a name I don't recognise and wonder if it would be a great idea for posters who understandably want to keep their recognised and respected name on FWR to occasionally use a different name to give the same information outside FWR (just to make it a little more difficult for their stalkers).

The drag queen one is "not accepting any new messages". Shame, because I was just about to add a link to drag queen story time....

@TurquoiseBaubles I do see your point - I can ask for my post to be removed if that would be best?

No I wouldn't worry about it WaitWhat. Those threads are obvious to anyone who wants to find them. I was just sort of pondering after I linked the prison thread.

I was fuming when the Bodyform thread was moved and was wondering why. It must have been reported by someone

Oh well done, AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken! Asking your TWAW primary teacher friend how she managed to juggle teaching that your “gender” isn't defined by how you outwardly express yourself I.e girls can be fire fighters and play with Lego and boys can be nurses and play with dolls etc with the idea that some girls are actually boys and some boys are actually girls because of how they outwardly express themselves e.g a boy who likes paying with dolls.

No tricks, no accusations (not that I ever hear those from GC feminists). Just an honest and straightforward question. No wonder how she couldn't answer it. And since she was honest enough to say you made a good point, let's hope she's thinking more about her TWAW faith.

There's a part 2 drag queen one somewhere - the op was chastised for starting a part 2 as apparently no-one cared (after the first thread reached 1000 posts ).

@TurquoiseBaubles

I think we need to be a little careful cross-linking from this board to others. I did it the other day on the prison thread, and afterwards thought that maybe I hadn't.

My fear is that it leads to (a) accusations of pile ins along the lines of "you headed over for reinforcements"; and more importantly (b) fears that the regular monitors on FWR will have their attention drawn to the threads elsewhere and mass report them.

Threads outside FWR are beginning to speak for themselves - there is pretty much no support for self-id, lots of support for single sex spaces, a fair amount of horror at what is going on with children, and a general waking up to the wider picture. I hate it when threads out there get moved to the naughty corner simply because some vindictive over-enthusiastic watcher demands it.

This is very true and yes let's remove any links now. I just think it's heartening to see the discussion growing outside of here.