GDST schools announce trans policy

[AgathaMystery]

Hopefully this share token will work. If not I will screen shot.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/01/01/group-girls-schools-says-will-not-accept-transgender-pupils/

*case by case basis

@jewel1968

So, will they be ok with trans boy pupils? Biological female but transitioned or transitioning to male.

I wonder sometimes if we should have less segregation by sex? Other than spaces where safety is an issue I wonder if less segregation would help demystify the opposite sex?

Whatever the transition, the transitioning pupils will not at any point cease to be female. Female people are perfectly used to female people presenting in all kinds of ways that they choose, from highly feminine to androgynous.

The massive majority of schools are mixed sex. Parents (and children) seeking single sex schools have intentionally gone looking for this specific facility for specific reasons of wishing to have it. The desire of one person to break boundaries when many other facilities are available to them is not a justifiable reason to deprive everyone else of this choice. It's just pure selfishness and a desire to smash up everyone else's norms for personal political reasons.

PaleBlueMoonlight

But doesn't the proportion means/legitimate aim aspect apply here?

The proportionate means is that there will be other, mixed schools available. And the legitimate aim is as they say, preserving their single sex status? (Parents pay for a girls' school because of all the documented benefits for girls).

The EHRC Technical Guidance to schools makes it clear children are protected under the EA re gender reassignment from the moment they express their intention to transition to anyone and that in schoolchildren, this intention is likely to be expressed via a change in clothes etc.

On the face of it, this makes sense. Why should a child be treated differently because of the clothes they wear?

But what is bewildering is the choice of comparator for deciding whether a person is being discriminated against. The comparator is an otherwise similar person without that protected characteristic. For a visually impaired person (PC: disability), a sighted person. How on earth were rational people persuaded to use a female person without the PC of gender reassignment, as the comparator for a male person with the PC of gender reassignment? That brings in yet another PC: sex.

The GDST's stance is the only rational one: using a person of the same sex as the comparator. They won't treat a pupil of one sex presenting with a (potential or actual) PC, less favourably than any other pupil of the same sex who does not present with that PC.

I welcome this decision - good to see clarity on an issue which, I think, has been causing headaches for a lot of girls' schools.

I would love to see a statement from some of the well-known boys' schools about this, though I imagine it hasn't been as much of a problem for them. Despite the higher rates of girls than boys identifying as the opposite sex, most of them aren't clamouring to get into single-sex boys' schools.

This thread is interesting, and seems to answer many of the questions on here:

mobile.twitter.com/legalfeminist/status/1477773300248072196

[quote delurkasaurus]This thread is interesting, and seems to answer many of the questions on here:

mobile.twitter.com/legalfeminist/status/1477773300248072196[/quote]
Very interesting.

I especially like this from a commenter.

"And they have stated that any female pupil who wishes to transition will be allowed to remain as a trans man therefore the policy as a whole can't be said to discriminate against trans people. It is about being single sex"

Also, if transactivists want to push this, then I can't wait to see all the traditional boys' schools getting right fucked off that they've got to go mixed sex as a result.

I imagine there will be plenty of girls who would like to go to one of those big, important, powerful boys' schools.

Despite the higher rates of girls than boys identifying as the opposite sex, most of them aren't clamouring to get into single-sex boys' schools.

I suspect most trans pupils, if they choose to leave their single sex schools, will be looking for co-ed. Indeed anecdotally I have heard this is already happening. My concern remains. Are single sex schools simply passing the buck. What protections exist for girls in co-Ed schools.

I worked at one of these schools and knowing the Head teacher I am not at all surprise. Such a good example to show the girls, to stand up for their rights.

On the face of it, this makes sense. Why should a child be treated differently because of the clothes they wear?

Jellysaurus Yes, on the face of it it does make sense and I suspect that at the time the guidance was written, it was to prevent the very very small numbers of children (mostly young boys) from being picked on, bullied etc for socially transitioning. I don’t think the EHRC would have foreseen activist groups and activist teachers pushing for immediate affirmation of what has been an exponential increase and a different cohort and all the safeguarding implications that arise from that, including whether or not a single sex school can remain single sex.

This trust owned my old girls school. A cracking school. Proud of them.

Its good news that's for sure. It would be better for the government to confirm the same guidance.

The wonderful Kellie Jay on GB News about half an hour ago.

That woke chap really has been at the kool-aid. He doesn't let facts get in the way of his narrative...

Oh KJ just swatted him away like an annoying mosquito buzzing around.

KJ gets better at this all the time. She used to wait politely for her turn (in the manner of a woman, naturally). These days she just gets stuck in.
Go go Kelly Jay

@Sonex

Good for them. interesting though as I have direct knowledge of one of the schoolmhaving a trans male student in sixth form a couple of years ago. It didn't work out and they left after the first year of with form. They'd been at the school prior to that as a girl since very young.

So they were still female?

Extraordinary when at the end he said he couldn’t understand how she could think that a girl going through puberty was suffering more than a man going through the trauma of realising he was trans gender.

He obviously hasn’t the faintest idea of how outrageous his presumption is that girls just don’t count if a man’s identity is at stake. He also has no idea of the abuse and threat of abuse that follows girls through their lives.

I am finding it so appalling that men are putting their heads above the parapet and hopefully waking up to the full extent of the misogynist nature of this ideology. I hope they are having a ‘be kind’ moment like many of us did - and then have the scales ripped from their eyes. It is truly extraordinary how men are debating what a woman is and what safe spaces we should be allowed without realising how this looks.

@caringcarer

I worked at one of these schools and knowing the Head teacher I am not at all surprise. Such a good example to show the girls, to stand up for their rights.

Totally agree with you - she sounds great, a brilliant role model.

This is the right decision for GDST schools - their USP is that they are offering single sex education for girls. In my area the GDST school has competition from some excellent schools that are mixed (and, in particular, a fantastic boys' school that is gradually moving to mixed) so they would be shooting themselves in the foot if they started to accept boys who identified as girls.

@Datun

PaleBlueMoonlight

But doesn't the proportion means/legitimate aim aspect apply here?

The proportionate means is that there will be other, mixed schools available. And the legitimate aim is as they say, preserving their single sex status? (Parents pay for a girls' school because of all the documented benefits for girls).

Sorry, for some reason didn't come back to the thread and was in a rush with my last post, but yes the argument I was outlining, in my view, is a terrible one! Worryingly, though I heard in the context of senior leadership in schools.

Glad you found the legal feminist analysis.

Oh good god there is a petition circulating to parents to say this is discriminatory. Why are parents putting their girls into girls school if they want boys present? Send them to a co-ed. We need to write directly to the gdst to support this. I have done so already. It is a homophobic, misogynistic ideology that reinforces regressive gender stereotypes.

Thanks Blessex
I've been meaning to write but will definitely get one off today as my daughters went to GDST and it was wonderful for them. I don't think they have any idea how lucky they are to have gone through their education with one of the pressures and day to day harassment that most girls routinely have to put up with.

I hope the parents will have the sense to ignore that petition. Sad,y I suspect many of the girls will come down on the BeeeKiiiind side and join in.

Just noticed I had a message deleted up thread. No idea what I said that was so inflammatory I thought I had just posted generally approving mild posts. 🤷‍♀️