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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

A woman driven out of her therapy group by a trans woman's presence

305 replies

PostingForTheFirstTime · 28/11/2021 08:51

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10249633/Rape-victim-forced-quit-therapy-sessions-feels-threatened-6ft-trans-woman.html

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5
littlbrowndog · 29/11/2021 11:29

Thank you Sarah for telling your story. Bloody awful that men are allowed to do this

And they are enabled to do this by services

RedCarpetRebellion · 29/11/2021 11:50

@IamSarah

Thanks again everyone. Busy morning.

My main priority is putting together a legal challenge. I want to make rape crisis organisations obliged to apply the EA exception and offer a single sex service even if the CEO / Trustees personally do not believe it is justified and absolutely believe TWAW.

Keep us up to date. We’ll dig.
Theflamingnerd · 29/11/2021 12:27

@IamSarah

Thanks again everyone. Busy morning.

My main priority is putting together a legal challenge. I want to make rape crisis organisations obliged to apply the EA exception and offer a single sex service even if the CEO / Trustees personally do not believe it is justified and absolutely believe TWAW.

You are so incredibly brave, thank you for sharing your story not just with us but the general public Flowers

I hope you have taken some comfort from the huge amount of support you have on this board. There is an incredible amount of knowledge here, and some amazing women fighting on all of our behalf. Please do not be afraid to reach out to them. Please do keep us updated, and post any links to petitions & crowdfunding.

RedCarpetRebellion · 29/11/2021 12:32

Not links, these get deleted. Just enough info so we can find them ourselves, or ask whose interested and pm us the links.

Theflamingnerd · 29/11/2021 12:54

@RedCarpetRebellion

Not links, these get deleted. Just enough info so we can find them ourselves, or ask whose interested and pm us the links.
Oh really? That's a shame

As I said... Lots of knowledgeable women on here (not me though Grin)

malanimo · 29/11/2021 13:30

Survivors Network's website says it is funded by "Brighton and Hove and East Sussex local authorities, Children in Need, The Office of the Police and Crime Commissioner, Brighton and Hove Third Sector Investment Partnership, NHS, Ministry of Justice, Lloyds Bank Foundation, Sussex Community Foundation, The National Lottery and Diocese of Chichester". Can we write to these organisations to let them know how their funding is being used? I wonder what the conditions for the funding were, and whether it was made clear that the groups would not be exclusively for female survivors

JustcameoutGC · 29/11/2021 13:35

That is a cause i will absolutely dig for.

Delphinium20 · 29/11/2021 14:50

Sarah - I too was raped - years ago. I had PTSD symptoms for a long while but time is a healer and have been doing well since my second child came along.

I am in awe that you can find strength to highlight this egregious behavior by an institution supposedly working on behalf of women. For over a decade, I experienced sheer terror and panic attacks whenever I came into contact with men who had the same physical feature as my rapist. How a rape crisis org can overlook the effect men have on us is mind boggling.

Thanks to you.

blusteredbirds · 29/11/2021 14:50

@IamSarah

Thanks again everyone. Busy morning.

My main priority is putting together a legal challenge. I want to make rape crisis organisations obliged to apply the EA exception and offer a single sex service even if the CEO / Trustees personally do not believe it is justified and absolutely believe TWAW.

You go! I'll support this case.
Artichokeleaves · 29/11/2021 15:03

@IamSarah

Thanks again everyone. Busy morning.

My main priority is putting together a legal challenge. I want to make rape crisis organisations obliged to apply the EA exception and offer a single sex service even if the CEO / Trustees personally do not believe it is justified and absolutely believe TWAW.

Right with you Sarah. Flowers

Although somewhat Hmm at the thought of public funded women's rape crisis centres having to be forced through law to grudgingly, angrily, wholly against their principles and with noses held, provide a service for raped women.

thinkingaboutLangCleg · 29/11/2021 15:38

Sarah, you are an inspiration.

I’ll look out for your crowdfunder and donate as much as I can. This is a fight we have to win. Shameful that women set up these services and now have to fight to regain them.

Waitwhat23 · 29/11/2021 17:47

@Artichokeleaves

Although somewhat hmm at the thought of public funded women's rape crisis centres having to be forced through law to grudgingly, angrily, wholly against their principles and with noses held, provide a service for raped women.

Couldn't agree more. It's absolutely shocking.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 29/11/2021 17:55

[quote Waitwhat23]@Artichokeleaves

Although somewhat hmm at the thought of public funded women's rape crisis centres having to be forced through law to grudgingly, angrily, wholly against their principles and with noses held, provide a service for raped women.

Couldn't agree more. It's absolutely shocking.[/quote]
Stand us up at the gates of hell and we can't back down on this because it is as flagrant a loss of services and contempt for women and survivors as it seems to be.

Deliriumoftheendless · 29/11/2021 18:12

@IamSarah

Thanks again everyone. Busy morning.

My main priority is putting together a legal challenge. I want to make rape crisis organisations obliged to apply the EA exception and offer a single sex service even if the CEO / Trustees personally do not believe it is justified and absolutely believe TWAW.

Good luck with this, Sarah, I wish you all the best.

The only people being disadvantaged here are women- There are support groups for men, trans people and a unisex group for those that want that but none exclusively for women.

Rosywillow · 29/11/2021 18:13

Thank you for sharing your story, iamsarah. It’s shocking.

Mumteedum · 29/11/2021 18:49

@EsmaCannonball

We often talk about women-only spaces in terms of male violence but what's more common is men as an inhibiting presence. It's just far easier for women to be open and honest and to connect with each other when men are not around. Women-only company isn't actually about being women, it's about being human beings, free from the male gaze or male judgement, and not always having to consider male feelings. You only have to look at how much better girls do in single-sex education to see how damaging and repressing just the presence of males can be.

There are men-only support groups or those Men in Shed-type groups that help men's mental health and provide friendship networks. I can see the value of these things and can't imagine being crass enough to destroy one by imposing myself into the company.

I totally agree.

I work in a university. I work in a male dominated field. One cohort has only two female students and one who is female sexed but non binary/other.

As an older woman, I am really aware of how my female students voices are drowned out by louder male peers. I ask them to be quiet when others speak, they eyeroll me and mutter and just keep doing it. I'm so sick of it. I'm just sick of male entitlement, everywhere.

I'm so sorry for what has happened to you @IamSarah. You're doing brilliantly standing up for what is right. I am sorry that you have to though.

BettyFilous · 29/11/2021 20:21

@IamSarah

Gosh you are all so kind. Thank you. It's been an intense day for lots of reasons.

This is just day 1, there is going to be a proper campaign to get our female services back. Will keep MN updated.

Thank you for speaking out Sarah. It is bravery like yours that will spare future rape survivors the distress you have endured, I have no doubt. I have a recently [mountaineer goalz] male friend and discussed the significant inroads that grassroots campaigns have made in combatting the insidious creep in this ideology with him. He was astonished at how many campaigns had got going over the last few years and the progress made. It just takes one, two or a few brave souls to plant a flag. Others will then rally around to build a groundswell of support. You have already made a difference. Just tell us how we can help. We are with you all the way. 💐
IamSarah · 29/11/2021 21:55

Thank you so much everyone. The support is really, really helping. Getting a lot of support on Twitter too and the TRAs have mainly left me alone.

Been in touch with the Equality Human Rights Commission who have given excellent advice and are writing to my centre on my behalf.

Just want to highlight this excellent point from @Artichokeleaves as it sums up everything I am trying to do:

Important to make very clear for the hard of thinking no one here wants trans people to lose services or not have access to services .

What is wanted is female only services available too for females who need them.

For women to have equal access and priority and equal consideration of their particular needs without forced teaming, without requirement to obey and centre male needs or lose services. For there not to be the situation where male people have three groups to choose their best fit from but instead of equality of choice, women get only one whether or not it's a good fit, and female people who cannot use mixed sex provision have no help or services at all.

This centre could have spared the space and staff for one single additional group on top of their offer. That some would struggle to tolerate its existence, even though their own needs are fully and properly met - that's not acceptable behaviour. It's not. It's not ok.

ArabellaScott · 29/11/2021 21:59

Fantastic news about EHRC, Sarah. Well done, again.

TheElvishQueen · 29/11/2021 22:01

Thank you Sarah.

beastlyslumber · 30/11/2021 07:59

I'm more than happy to support this campaign in any way I can.

highame · 30/11/2021 08:08

It's fantastic that the EHRC have finally got their act together and are correcting the false advice given when David Isaac was chair, though I suspect it will be some time before organisations get the message. More court cases is our best bet right now. A women's crowd funder site would be excellent

ClaudiaJ1 · 30/11/2021 09:49

Do you think it's possible to organise a protest outside the centre? I don't live in the UK so can't offer practical support, but the more people who know about this, the better, and perhaps if women who attend the centre for group sessions don't know about this and find out from a protest outside their centre, they too may add to the many women's voices of dissent.

@IamSarah has any survivor from the group contacted you in support, or know about this?

KittenKong · 30/11/2021 09:59

I think that may intimidate the clients of the centre.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 30/11/2021 10:01

I don't think a protest outside the centre would be helpful (if it's even a public location). It might intimidate women accessing the centre, and from what I have seen on this issue, any criticism at all of sexual violence support centres and their "inclusive" policy potentially harming women, such as Edinburgh Rape Crisis has resulted in a massive DARVO pushback from the usual suspects and their allies for "stopping women being able to access support". Even just tweeting about them, which is ridiculous.

I think they have to push back so hard as most normal people are rightly appalled by female rape victims not being able to have a female only space.