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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Anti-pronouns letter to companies

251 replies

Sunkisses · 31/10/2021 08:13

This is an email a friend wrote to a law firm about how seeing pronouns in their staff emails makes her feel, as a woman. Apparently it may have worked as the male lawyer stopped putting pronouns in his signature. She wants other women to adapt it. She set up a gmail account in another name as she didn't want her email to result in negative treatment from the staff, but wanted the firm to know how statements of allegiance to gender ideology makes her feel.

Dear XX

I am a client of yours but I am sending this from an anonymous email account as I do not feel safe sending this from my real account, and fear it will have repurcussions on my treatment by your staff.

I wanted you to know that two of your staff who I deal with have she/her and he/him in their email signatures. I don't know if this is a standard practice and encouraged by XX, or if this is peculiar to these two staff.

I see the statement of pronouns in email signatures as a political statement on an extremely controversial and divisive issue. It makes me feel incredibly uncomfortable, alienated, and quite fearful that I may not receive fair treatment if I disagreed with your staff on this issue. I wanted XX to know how I feel about this, and how many people are likely to feel.

The two staff are clearly female and male, and there is absolutely no reason for them to add these pronouns to their email signature apart from to make a clear political statement on their position on a very divisive issue. I do not believe your staff should be inserting their political positions into their communications with clients, especially on uniquely divisive issues. You would not expect to see staff stating their position on Brexit in their email signatures, with "Leave" or "Remain" added under their contact details. Or people stating "Christ is Lord" or "Allahu Akbar". Or "Vaccinate now" or "Lift lockdown" added.

I profoundly disagree with gender identity ideology. I see it as regressive, sexist and homophobic. I do not regard it as progressive in the slightest. I regard much of gender identity activism as extremely authoritarian and a threat to freedom of thought, belief, and expression, and a threat to the rights of women and girls. I profoundly disagree with the attempts to redefine what a woman is, and what same-sex attraction is. From conversations I have, most people agree with me but many are too fearful of saying so as this issue is so controversial and trans activists are incredibly aggressive and target people in their workplaces.

When I see your staff acting as activists with political statements in their email signatures it does not make me feel comfortable at all, and makes me feel like they would not treat me fairly if they knew that I profoundly disagreed with their political views on the importance of women's rights. It makes me feel they oppose the rights of women and girls, and it makes me feel alienated and completely excluded.

I ask that XX reconsider whether it is appropriate for staff to have political statements such as pronouns in their email signatures, and whether staff should be using their workplace as a forum for their activism.

Yours, XX

OP posts:
Calyx72 · 31/10/2021 13:40

@EarthSight that's much better in my opinion.

GreyhoundG1rl · 31/10/2021 13:41

Ok, just ignore my comment that I delete emails like this on a daily basis regardless of content....
From clients?! Maybe you need to stop doing that?

Wordsmith · 31/10/2021 13:50

I'd remove the 5th and 6th paragraphs. And probably the 4th.

timeisnotaline · 31/10/2021 14:20

@MidsomerMurmurs I don’t think I understand the religious point. I have of course to respect my staff’s religious beliefs up to the point where they impinge on others rights - I’m not sure for example what I would do if a man refused to shake hands, I think a lot would depend on if done with respect or not. I have to be able to let Jewish staff leave on time to be home by sunset on Friday. I think that pronouns have been normalised enough that if I tried to ban them I would be on the wrong side of the lawsuit, and I would genuinely be failing in my duty to my staff. I also feel there are better battles to fight, this one is so easily portrayed as the chronically offended think they can ban someone from writing their own email signature.

donquixotedelamancha · 31/10/2021 14:27

I think that pronouns have been normalised enough that if I tried to ban them I would be on the wrong side of the lawsuit and I would genuinely be failing in my duty to my staff.

Genuine question: which law, what duty?

one is so easily portrayed as the chronically offended think they can ban someone from writing their own email signature.

Where staff pick therir own signature with total freedom I think that's fine but it really isn't unusual for employers to expect professional signatures with only work related info on.

KimikosNightmare · 31/10/2021 14:35

I have to be able to let Jewish staff leave on time to be home by sunset on Friday

What do you say to other staff who say , "you know what, I'd quite like an early start to my weekend too"

Lack of belief is a protected characteristic too. If you consistently allow this to one set of employees but deny it to others you run the risk of discriminating against the non- believers. An employer can't insist its non- believers pick up all the Friday nights, Saturday and Sunday shifts its staff of various believers say they can't do.

KimikosNightmare · 31/10/2021 14:39

I think that pronouns have been normalised enough that if I tried to ban them I would be on the wrong side of the lawsuit and I would genuinely be failing in my duty to my staff

I've never worked anywhere where e- mail signs off were not set to a corporate template. The only personal information is name, position, mobile number and direct dial number.

ErrolTheDragon · 31/10/2021 14:46

It's a good idea, OP, and I'm sure people can work out how to adapt it to their own circumstances.

Floisme · 31/10/2021 15:01

This is interesting as I must admit up until now I'd really only been concerned about compelled pronoun declarations. But I take the point about it being more than a purely personal, political neutral act. And yes, what's the difference between using your email signature to declare your beliefs about gender identity and using it to declare your religion or political affiliations? Plenty to think about.

EarthSight · 31/10/2021 15:07

Further edit -

Dear XX

I am a client of yours but I am sending this from an anonymous email account out of fear I will experience repurcussions by your staff if they knew my identity. This letter concerns the use of pronouns in your staff's email signatures.

I wanted to let you know that I see the inclusion pronouns in email signatures as a political statement. I'm concerned that I may not receive fair treatment if I disagreed with your staff about their opinions. This disagreement may well happen. By being so open in their signatures, they have taken the first step in discussing such matters with clients.

I would like to ask if your company supports or requires making similar political declarations? For example, statements about Brexit, lockdowns, vaccines or ones about their religion or sexuality?

I believe my concerns about this practice and the repercussions of disagreeing with the related ideology are reasonable. Trans activists have and do target people in their workplaces (which is why I will not reveal my identity), and some are particularly abusive towards women. Whilst I do not know if your staff agree with such tactics, as a client I feel like should be to be wary considering the often aggressive nature of activism that is related to pronoun usage.

Therefore, I ask you to consider whether it is professionally impartial or appropriate for staff to have such, or indeed any political statements such as pronouns in their email signatures, and hope you understand the negative effects this practice may have on your clients.

**

Please proof-read it first before using it.

KimikosNightmare · 31/10/2021 15:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

tinkerbellvspredator · 31/10/2021 15:19

I'm in the public sector and it seems to be slowly spreading. People I work with are doing it, and I saw my first they/them in the wild the other day.

Carlosa · 31/10/2021 15:21

More and more people in my company are adding pronouns to their footers. Young women mostly who lack the life experience to see why it's not a good idea.

I had a conversation with a dear friend recently who said she adds her pronouns to emails. We didn't get too deeply in to it but I did tell her that while I could understand her reasons, I disagreed with it and told her why.

Interestingly her girlfriend is also against pronouns in emails so I'm hoping my friend will have a think about it. We both agreed that respectful discussion is important and cut the conversation short before either of us got heated...

MidsomerMurmurs · 31/10/2021 15:29

@timeisnotaline I don’t think I understand the religious point

The argument is that gender ideology is a faith (akin to religious faiths). It is fine for anyone to believe that they have an inner essence that “is” their gender. In the same way, it is fine for someone with a religious faith to believe that they have a soul, that is their inner essence.

But it’s not normal for people to state that in every interaction they have at work. And it’s not normal for people to assume that everyone has a soul, and that those who refuse to believe are heretics, or are trying to deny Christians’ existence.

It also would be weird to do this for the protected characteristics of EA2010. If I have no disability, should I put “I’m not disabled” at the bottom of every email? Would that help people who are disabled? Should I put “I’m white Caucasian!” in my signature? Would that help people from other ethnic groups?

stillcrazyafterall · 31/10/2021 15:35

Christ, can some please send this to every Government department? The one I work for really needs to get this!

Anycolourwilldo · 31/10/2021 15:51

@TreXX - I find your comment about deleting ranty emails strange. If I did that, I wouldn't be doing my job properly. Who would not read an email from a disgruntled client? To delete without reading would be highly unprofessional.

prettybird · 31/10/2021 15:54

My (usual) shortening of my first name, combined with my Germanic surname, means that in writing people assume that I'm a male. I was never bothered by that as it should be irrelevant what sex I am when dealing with me.

Indeed, (and this shows how long ago it was - well before emails Blush), early this n my career, when we were getting some business cards printed, my colleague wanted me to include a title on mine (Ms or Miss) on the basis that "people wouldn't know what sex I was". My boss supported me in having no title on the basis that since business cards tend to me handed out, if they didn't know what sex I was (young, attractive graduate if I say so myself Wink) , then they had bigger problems Grin

Heaven knows how I'd cope in today's environment - I certainly wouldn't want to be forced to announce my sex/gender (as they're both the same in my case) as I think it's irrelevant in a business environment Confused If they responded to me assuming I was male, that was fine by me - what would have been wrong was if they'd responded to me .differently because I wasn't the sex they expected me to be. Hmm

I think the email is good, if maybe a bit wordy. I've just used a small part of it to explain why I'm stepping from a (voluntary) role where I'd have been expected to promote an (IMHO) unthinking agenda of TWAW to the detriment of women's sex based rights.

FrancescaContini · 31/10/2021 15:55

Excellent letter! Thank you for posting it.

Bemusedatone · 31/10/2021 16:03

I agree with the sentiments but I'd say it's a bit whiney, demanding and over-emotional.
Sound like anyone else? Best to rise above and be factual, practical and to the point.

Sorry, just my opinion.

doorornottodoor · 31/10/2021 16:13

Good but too long and repetitive. Need the red pen out! Great idea though!

Floisme · 31/10/2021 16:22

Who would not read an email from a disgruntled client? To delete without reading would be highly unprofessional.
It's not an email from a known client, it's anonymous. I understand the reasons for that but I doubt if any company would feel obliged to read it, and I imagine there's a high chance it would go straight into Spam. Absolutely essential to keep it short and compelling I'd have thought.

BlackAlys · 31/10/2021 16:36

Ooof that is one amazing template that I'm going to use.

Thank you for sharing

ScribblingPixie · 31/10/2021 16:49

I wonder if it's good to have a version that sounds a bit male and pompous up your sleeve - something like:

As a client of yours, I am concerned that I have received a letter in which members of your staff have added pronouns to their email signatures.

I regard this as a political statement, entirely unrelated andirrelevantto any discussion I might have with your firm. And given the heightened atmosphere around discussions of gender politics currently, I am most concerned that this is an indication that I may be drawn into unwanted discussion and even argument on the matter.

Therefore, I ask you to consider whether it is appropriate to continue with this practice. My concern is such that I am taking the step of withholding my identity, which is not something I would have imagined Iwould need to do in communication with your company.

Bellusaurus · 31/10/2021 16:55

@KimikosNightmare

I have to be able to let Jewish staff leave on time to be home by sunset on Friday

What do you say to other staff who say , "you know what, I'd quite like an early start to my weekend too"

Lack of belief is a protected characteristic too. If you consistently allow this to one set of employees but deny it to others you run the risk of discriminating against the non- believers. An employer can't insist its non- believers pick up all the Friday nights, Saturday and Sunday shifts its staff of various believers say they can't do.

If it's putting an unreasonable burden on other staff and / or the business generally, it's reasonable to refuse this.

If not, it's not reasonable to refuse under current legislation.

Lack of belief is a protected characteristic, but that doesn't mean you can't offer reasonable adjustments for believers that differ from conditions from non-believers.

Bellusaurus · 31/10/2021 17:07

@ScribblingPixie

I wonder if it's good to have a version that sounds a bit male and pompous up your sleeve - something like:

As a client of yours, I am concerned that I have received a letter in which members of your staff have added pronouns to their email signatures.

I regard this as a political statement, entirely unrelated andirrelevantto any discussion I might have with your firm. And given the heightened atmosphere around discussions of gender politics currently, I am most concerned that this is an indication that I may be drawn into unwanted discussion and even argument on the matter.

Therefore, I ask you to consider whether it is appropriate to continue with this practice. My concern is such that I am taking the step of withholding my identity, which is not something I would have imagined Iwould need to do in communication with your company.

I like that but I think I'd keep the Brexit / religious / Covid examples. You're not arguing against trans ideology here, but a reader could still dismiss as about your stance on trans issues. Good to remove refs to your own beliefs for some recipients, but a couple of these examples hammer home the point that there's activism at play here.