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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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John Lewis and it’s ‘gender relaxed’ ad

634 replies

SouthernFashionista · 11/10/2021 19:44

Curious to hear thoughts on the new ad from John Lewis. It strikes me as sinister. Why does a small child have to send out a message of LGBTQ equality? Why is he acting like a drag queen.

OP posts:
mustlovegin · 14/10/2021 19:01

Excellent and concise article Pronouns

Businesses had better steer clear from this agency (their name is rather ironic BTW)

GAHgamel · 14/10/2021 19:01

Is any one here old enough to remember the Mini-Pops?

NecessaryScene · 14/10/2021 19:15

Just to shout a bit louder about the above link - that is Posie Parker writing for the Spectator.

Money quote:

This is about ‘inclusion’, which is a new euphemism for male entitlement.

(She's still banned from Mumsnet, but I guess she's moving up in the world... Sad)

KimikosNightmare · 14/10/2021 19:35

@merrymouse

This one is the complete opposite. It's not just the sex angle that bothers me (male messes things up while long-suffering females look on) but also the money/entitlement- don't worry about smashing everything up, someone will clean it up, someone will pay for a new one. Urgh.

Yes - the smug entitlement is really off-putting. Deliberately destroying property just isn't the same as getting a bit muddy as in the Persil Ad.

It's all very Bullingdon Club.

The irony is of course that Pink News and their like who are lauding it would be first in the queue to condemn the Bullingdon Club and anyone who had ever been in the Bullingdon Club.

Not defending the Bullingdon Club but at least they had the rule that all damage had to be paid for by them in full.

Whatthechicken · 14/10/2021 19:52

I used to hate watching Top Gear, because they regularly used to smash up old caravans or they’d have a football match with new ‘affordable cars’ - they would all, always get bashed up. I used to sit there and cringe, thinking ‘someone could make use of that, and they’re smashing it up’. My kids wouldn’t dream of damaging our stuff on purpose. They are only 5 & 6, but they know things cost money, they also know that ‘home’ is their sanctuary. Apart from anything else, considering the climate change crisis we are currently in, JL are doing nothing for the environment with this ad: ‘just smash things up and replace with more things!’.

Three0fivepointfour · 14/10/2021 20:17

OMG. It is the Minipops! I was a child, 8/9/10 when they were on but even then my frie da and I knew it was wrong!

Piapiano · 14/10/2021 21:41

Interesting that the ad agency previously designed a period product advert putting a girl with short hair in the men's toilets. Makes me think the colours etc. were definitely not accidental.

elgreco · 15/10/2021 08:02

Its a shit add. I am a poor housekeeper and my kids run a bit wild (not deliberately wrecking the gaff ) and as a consequence my house is a scruffy mess. It doesn't resemble the house in the add. Even I wouldn't leave glitter in bowls! In the kitchen!

Not to mention the bullying and destruction of the sisters art. Fuck that.

DaisyNGO · 15/10/2021 09:09

Clymene that's interesting, did they specify an age limit for children?

Tedimhoardingrightsosaur · 15/10/2021 09:24

@GAHgamel

Is any one here old enough to remember the Mini-Pops?
Oh yes. Mid/late 80s wasn't it? All kinds of wrong.
knittingaddict · 15/10/2021 09:29

WTF mumsnet. You deleted my post?

All it said was that no group woud be happy about their protrayal in that ad. Not boys/men, not trans, not women. That was worthy of deletion? Who is reporting these posts and why are they seen as so sensitive?

MamsellMarie · 15/10/2021 10:37

I think they must have software deleting becausemine was deleted before I even saw it on the thread.

Wroxie · 15/10/2021 10:50

I wonder if everyone is aware that there never was a moose loose around the hoose, either. It was all made up to be funny and to get people talking and make them remember the product! Wild, isn't it?

Artichokeleaves · 15/10/2021 10:54

I'm finding it increasingly sad that LGBT+ and women are things to be funny and controversial, and that angering and offending seem to have become the new cool way to get the hits and the product noticed.

Next week: a jolly good laugh at old people and the disabled while you're sold microwaves.

merrymouse · 15/10/2021 11:01

@Wroxie

I wonder if everyone is aware that there never was a moose loose around the hoose, either. It was all made up to be funny and to get people talking and make them remember the product! Wild, isn't it?
What is funny about throwing your sister’s paints on the floor?

It’s all a bit close to the ‘sex got out of hand’ defence.

As others have said, this is not an ad showing a boy being feminine, it’s an ad showing a boy dominating his mother and sister.

GoldChick · 15/10/2021 11:02

@Wroxie

I wonder if everyone is aware that there never was a moose loose around the hoose, either. It was all made up to be funny and to get people talking and make them remember the product! Wild, isn't it?
Difference is that this isn't funny. He's just a vandal.
Gingernaut · 15/10/2021 11:32

@Wroxie

I wonder if everyone is aware that there never was a moose loose around the hoose, either. It was all made up to be funny and to get people talking and make them remember the product! Wild, isn't it?
The trouble is, @Wroxie, Hoots Mon! by The Lairds of Rock and Waccy Maccy were used for a zany ad for Maynard's Wine Gums.

This ad is misleading potential customers about insurance coverage.

Accidental damage is covered, deliberate vandalism of the type depicted in the ad, is not.

scarpa · 15/10/2021 14:12

*What is funny about throwing your sister’s paints on the floor?

It’s all a bit close to the ‘sex got out of hand’ defence.*

merrymouse, that's one of the most deranged things I've ever read on this website. You think children deliberately making a mess is 'a bit close' to someone murdering someone? Genuinely?

Clymene · 15/10/2021 14:28

@DaisyNGO

Clymene that's interesting, did they specify an age limit for children?
Nope.
KimikosNightmare · 15/10/2021 15:17

@scarpa

*What is funny about throwing your sister’s paints on the floor?

It’s all a bit close to the ‘sex got out of hand’ defence.*

merrymouse, that's one of the most deranged things I've ever read on this website. You think children deliberately making a mess is 'a bit close' to someone murdering someone? Genuinely?

Setting aside the hyperbolic comparison- what is funny about destroying his sister's paints?

I'm not seeing anything funny there. I just saw a bully.

Franca123 · 15/10/2021 15:35

Bizarre advert. I see it as a perfect representation of everything that is wrong with Stonewall's side of the argument. However I doubt that that was their intention. Deeply uncomfortable how they've tried to make the poor child actor parody a sexy woman. Weird and pervy. Can you imagine what the director was saying to him during filming. Gross.

Franca123 · 15/10/2021 15:43

@TrainedByDinosaurs

I wonder if those people who don’t see a problem may lack some awareness of warnings of inappropriate sexual behaviour in children (and dare I saw it understanding of how safeguarding works). This useful resource describes how to tell if a child’s behaviour is inappropriate.

www.stopitnow.org.uk/concerned-about-a-child-or-young-persons-sexual-behaviour/how-to-tell-if-a-childs-sexual-behaviour-is-age-appropriate/

Stop it Now is a resource for the UK & Ireland aiming to help stop child sexual abuse. It is run by the Lucy Faithful foundation which is the only uk charity dedicated to preventing child sexual abuse.

The pouting, arm draped up the wall and hip jutting behaviour shown in the advert would definitely fall under ‘mimicking sexual flirting behaviour too advanced for age’ which is an amber category behaviour for the child in the adverts age group which they advise requires a response from a protective adult, extra support and close monitoring.

Showing this type of warning behaviour in an advert and implying it is nothing to be concerned about ie ‘normalising it’ is highly irresponsible.

Thank you for this. This isn't something i know much about but watching that advert definitely sent my alarm bells ringing. This helps explain my reaction. Deeply wrong to normalise this behaviour when it is far from normal.
Franca123 · 15/10/2021 15:44

I will never shop at John Lewis or Waitrose again.

scarpa · 15/10/2021 15:53

Oh I'm not saying it was funny, @KimikosNightmare - just that it's not remotely outside the boundaries of normal (if naughty) childhood behaviour, and comparing it to cases of women being strangled to death during sex is deeply, deeply weird.

I wouldn't call it 'bullying' either, to be honest - for a start, you see one instance of a kid being a little shit, which isn't bullying, and I can't think of a single kid I know who hasn't done something deliberately mean (and/or destructive) to their sibling at some point. I chopped my sister's Barbie hair off once cos she annoyed me. She coloured in Robbie Williams' eyes on my Take That diary. It wasn't bullying, it was just thoughtless, mean kid behaviour.

I feel like people are taking this advert WILDLY out of proportion. You're telling me nobody has seen a kid play dress up or behave badly before? I've got a photo of me and my cousin, about 7 years old - he's wearing a princess dress with his hand on his hip, posing, and some expertly applied blue eyeshadow (my handiwork) and I'm wearing a cat costume. We weren't a fucking safeguarding risk or a trans allegory, we were being children.