My 17 yo DD tells me she is a boy but I seem to be such a terrible mother for not going along with it

[pixiecolour]

My DD has a terrible time growing up, really struggled, was bullied at school and has had issues with mental health for a while now (we have entered the CAMHS zone 💩). Aged 13 she spent time at school with a girl who transitioned, and told my DD that all her worries were really down to the fact that she is actually a boy. Cue the Dysphoria (self diagnosed) and now she is 17 hates me because I can't go along with the whole thing, but I can see through it. Communication has broken down and we are in a very dark place.

Also, I've found the Gender a Wider Lens podcast an absolute lifeline and it shows ways to be supportive as a parent, whilst not pretending to believe something you don't.

Absolutely, I agree too. The OP is entitled to use whatever pronouns she likes to describe her own daughter in this thread, which her daughter will never see. OP may well decide to use her daughters preferred pronouns in their own family life etc but that no ones business but hers. Just back off pronoun police! Jeez!

Telling a GNC girl she's a boy, is inherently sexist. Coupled with bullying, no wonder her confidence and sense of self is through the floor.

"Could be real"... What does that even mean? A person who transitions young and never regrets it as an adult? Young transition is so new, we have little data on that. But Keira Bell's case should give pause.

A person who will go on to transition, regardless? In pretty much every interview with parents of trans children or with a trans adult about their childhood, there is a story involving sexism, homophobia, and bullying. If an individual is young (which 17 is - our brains do not mature until 24 ish) would it not be helpful to try and unpick the damage of the sexism /homophobia /bullying that the child has experienced? Or should we prize those attitudes because they result in people transitioning rather than being gender non conforming or gay? Should we make sure all kids are exposed to sexism, homophobia and bullying?

OF COURSE a 17 year old should be able to wear what they want, like who and what they like, and use whatever name. Any 17 year old. Gender stereotypes and expectations are regressive bullshit.

And of course it is really hard as the parent to balance the line between reality and not losing a teen's trust. Inspired Teen Therapy - Sasha Ayad - on twitter, is great for this. She cautions against making it hard for a child to change their mind. Which grand pronoun announcements and presentations at school does, for example.

"Could be real"... What does that even mean?

I'd like to know that too.

@Kiduknot would you come back and explain what you mean by 'could be real'?

@midgemagneto

I do find some posts a bit off

Using he pronoun to avoid offending someone not on the thread completely ignores the feelings of the person who created the thread ... like their feelings DJ t matter

Of course the feelings of the person starting the thread matter. The point myself and others was trying to make is that by using her child’s preferred pronouns she helps to keep dialogue open with them. The more she alienates them the harder it will be to help them

Of course the feelings of the person starting the thread matter.
The point myself and others was trying to make is that by using her child’s preferred pronouns she helps to keep dialogue open with them.
The more she alienates them the harder it will be to help them

So you decided to force the point and use them for her? Really? Doesn't sound like you care that much for the ops feelings at all.

You feel that using the child's current preferred pronouns when not actually talking to the child will help communicating?

I think it would be more useful to build a relationship based on love and respect not deferral and door mat behaviour

@midgemagneto

I think it would be more useful to build a relationship based on love and respect not deferral and door mat behaviour

Well what OP has done so far hasn’t worked so maybe she can try something else?

Bringing up a child is a meandering try and fail and try again process

On both sides

Op has had some useful suggestions and some downright dangerous suggestions made

@Mallowmazing

I am so sorry you are in this difficult place.

People will be along with advice soon.

Please ignore people who say that you need to support her transition. Would those people tell the mum of an anorexic teen that she needs to support her calorie restriction?

how dare you. Shame on you.

No one is trying to convert your child. If they were gay, you'd support them right? This is the same. Ultimately you want your child to reach their full potential. Listen to them and just be their rock.

@Conniethesensible

No one is trying to convert your child. If they were gay, you'd support them right? This is the same. Ultimately you want your child to reach their full potential. Listen to them and just be their rock.

Please can you explain why you think this is the same as being gay?

Because one of the reasons many of us are concerned about this is that even the Tavistock clinic themselves admit that many of the children requesting transition are actually lesbian girls. And because interviews about the childhoods of people who have transitioned almost always contain experience of homophobia.

By unquestioningly confirming transition, one risks the implicit message that being gay and /or gender non conforming is not acceptable.

Real was a wrong choice of word. Sorry

I meant that it could be a long lasting need, with no change of mind.
The op seems to think differently and that this is just a phase.

@Scutterbug

You think you can see through it but have you thought that this might actually be real? I’d support them on their journey, they’re old enough to make this decision x

If her daughter has a vagina, it isn't real.

I think it could be long lasting but it's unlikely to be fundamental

An untreated wound can be long lasting, but isn't something to aspire too after all

The child isn't male. It is significantly better for the child's future physical health if they can accept that

I'd suggest it's also significantly better for the child's future mental health if they can accept that snd understand what made them think otherwise

@Kiduknot

Real was a wrong choice of word. Sorry

I meant that it could be a long lasting need, with no change of mind.
The op seems to think differently and that this is just a phase.

The OP knows her child better than we do.

@Conniethesensible

No one is trying to convert your child. If they were gay, you'd support them right? This is the same. Ultimately you want your child to reach their full potential. Listen to them and just be their rock.

@Conniethesensible please explain how this is 'the same' as being gay.

When teenagers identify as transgender this often leads very rapidly to medication with hormone blockers, then cross sex hormones and often surgical procedures.

I can't see any similarity at all with a child who tells their parents that they are gay. Can you explain what I'm missing? What medical treatment does being gay lead to?

I’m glad the internet wasn’t here when I was a child. I was a Tom boy, I thought life would be better if I was a boy, I wanted to actually be a boy. Looking back, for me personally it was just a phase, I still don’t wear frilly skirts or make up, but I am me, just me.

Kids nowadays have way too much pressure to put labels on things, because apparently phases are not something that happens to this generation.

Ultimately you want your child to reach their full potential.

This should include allowing them to reach adulthood without sending them down a path which will lead to sterilisation.

What matters more, showing your child that you love and support them or your beliefs on the validity of being trans?

You don’t believe they can change their sex. That’s fine but would it cost you so much to use their preferred name and/or pronouns. They are the exact same person whether they call themselves a boy or a girl.

I’m sorry. I know my views are not popular but actually it is our job as parents to protect our children. I would be saying this to her. It is my one job to protect you. Calling you something you are not is not protecting you. Your mental health is important but this is not the cure. I love you.

If they were gay, you'd support them right?

Does supporting a 17 year old lesbian mean accepting that she may be on the path to a non-medically necessary hysterectomy?

POST HYSTERECTOMY VAGINAL VAULT PROLAPSE

What is a vaginal vault prolapse?

Vaginal vault prolapse commonly occurs following a hysterectomy (removal of the uterus (womb)). Because the uterus provides support for the top of the vagina, this condition occurs in up to 40% of women after a hysterectomy.

In a vaginal vault prolapse, the top of the vagina gradually falls toward the vaginal opening. Eventually, the top of the vagina may protrude out of the body through the vaginal opening, effectively turning the vagina inside out. A vaginal vault prolapse is often accompanied by the weakness and prolapse of walls of the vagina.

Source: www.oxfordgynaecology.com/conditions-we-treat/vaginal-prolapse/post-hysterectomy-vault-prolapse/

[quote PurgatoryOfPotholes]If they were gay, you'd support them right?

Does supporting a 17 year old lesbian mean accepting that she may be on the path to a non-medically necessary hysterectomy?

POST HYSTERECTOMY VAGINAL VAULT PROLAPSE

What is a vaginal vault prolapse?

Vaginal vault prolapse commonly occurs following a hysterectomy (removal of the uterus (womb)). Because the uterus provides support for the top of the vagina, this condition occurs in up to 40% of women after a hysterectomy.

In a vaginal vault prolapse, the top of the vagina gradually falls toward the vaginal opening. Eventually, the top of the vagina may protrude out of the body through the vaginal opening, effectively turning the vagina inside out. A vaginal vault prolapse is often accompanied by the weakness and prolapse of walls of the vagina.

Source: www.oxfordgynaecology.com/conditions-we-treat/vaginal-prolapse/post-hysterectomy-vault-prolapse/[/quote]
Jesus fucking christ 😳