I think I've figured out why the Guilty Feminists feel guilty...

[vivariumvivariumsvivaria]

@Glinner sent this round today:

"(From a thread by @Forwomenscot) The CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis has said "Sexual violence happens to bigoted people too. But if you bring beliefs that are discriminatory, expect to be challenged on your prejudice. Reframe your trauma" Apparently, survivors are to be "educated" in this service."

The CEO is Mridul Wadhwa, a male person who does not have a GRC and who believes that rape victims orgasm.

The podcast twitter account is blocking everyone who says "WTF?" etc

Littlebrown thank you for all the excellent links and info in this thread

TRANSCRIPT of Mridul Wadhwa on the Guilty Feminist podcast
forwomen.scot/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Mridul-Wadhwa-Guilty-Feminist-transcript.pdf

The sole purpose of rape crisis centres is to support victims of rape. They are not validation tools. Therefore Wadhwa is extremely bigoted in demanding the victims centre Wadhwa and has shown their absolute unsuitability for their role.

I would really like to hear your reasoning.

It seems like a sort of dehumanisation arising from "progressive stack" thinking. You don't see people as individuals, you see them as part of an identity group, and treat them on that basis. Regardless of what they've personally experienced.

As such, Wadhwa, being trans, is far more oppressed than the "cis, white, heteronormative women" that insist on taking up the service's valuable time with their petty rapes.

So the women will have to take one for the team, to help balance out Wadhwa's alleged group oppression.

And there's a kind of inversion of what Spock said - "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one". That's the logical way to construct a system, but in this sort of "fight the system" thinking, (certain) individuals gets prioritised, no matter the total harm. The majority deserve to suffer just for being the majority, almost (ie " "normative").

This is very much the modern Disney mindset where the misunderstood hero fights an oppressive system. "The desires of the one outweigh the needs of the many." (Although usually there is denial that there's any conflict, so no "outweighing"). Unfortunately we can't ALL be the lead character and expect everyone else to be supporting actors. We need a system that can maintain tens of millions of lead characters.

If people are trained to think in that romantic "hero vs the world" mindset, then they're primed for a conman willing to exploit that, if he can just persuade people that he's the hero and misunderstood, and everyone else is the mean nasty society. Tap into excessively-narrow sympathy, forgetting the wider picture.

Wow Thank you necessary that's a hugely helpful explanation.

[quote littlbrowndog]Very good piece here from forwomen Scotland

Explaining the background

forwomen.scot/10/08/2021/the-real-crisis-at-rape-crisis-scotland/?fbclid=IwAR0F_4HKh_UtdbAe_zmEPMQowOsUr0_vvPeKZZ3rer7nCYFNEKcdRJE9t4E[/quote]
They also, shockingly, revealed that local services were frightened to state publicly that they could guarantee female only services because of the reaction from those who want to prevent women accessing such a service. We are sure that such people include those in the sector, like Wadhwa, as well as in Government.

This is what it's come to.

Yeah that’s what it come to

Women in Scotland provdiding services to women and girls who have been sexually assulted too afraid to speak

Where’s our first minister sturgeon feminist to her fingernails not speaking out about this ?

Women and girls no longer important?

Not read the thread but can I have a direct link to the podcast? I can't seem to access it.

*I'd like to see research on males demanding entry into female trauma and health services. Such as:

• rape centres and helplines
• breastfeeding classes
• menstruation
• menopause
• female-only health conditions - endometriosis,
• miscarriages
• stillborns

To understand what's driving these males, why they do it, what the impact is and categorise the conditions so that the public know what they're dealing with*

I would agree completely. This seems like a very important question.

Never mind - got it.

Word of day. Apply this to my government

@littlbrowndog

Word of day. Apply this to my government

Dang! I know lots of people think she does it on purpose, I wasn't so sure until just now.

Yes thanks @NecessaryScene for that very clear explanation of 'stack thinking '. Very useful .

Wow that transcript. Jaw droppingly awful.

If anyone has the slightest feeling that these women are feminists in any sense of the word, read it. They are the furthest thing it is possible to be. You'd get as much sympathy as a woman wanting a female only space from a men's rights group. DFW basically implies that raped women need to acknowledge that they haven't had it as hard as MW and MTF trans women, and she says that trans people face more violence and women argue about that and say they don't, but that's not true because we can "make the stats say what we want"

Chucking around the word "violence" about women's words like it's woke confetti.

Deborah Frances-White:
We need a massive rethink as a society. And feminism needs a big old rethink on this because if we are not there to protect the most vulnerable members of our group, what are we there for. As you said before Mridul, there is a social licence to treat trans people very badly, to rule them out of employment, to speak in rude ways about them, and to them, for street harassment, there's a social licence, we need to revoke that licence. It is the job of feminism to revoke that licence, and to step up, and step forward and say, these people are our sisters, these people are our siblings, and we need trans people to be protected. And we take that first step today. And if we have some discomfort because of the power structures that raised us, and that evolved us and evolved our thinking, that are in themselves structurally violent, then we need to do that work on ourselves, to get more comfortable with doing the right thing, and protecting kind people who want a break and desperately need a break from our society.

Kemah Bob:
I think it's a moment to check your privilege. And I think we've gotten to an interesting place in society where we're acknowledging the structural inequalities that women face across the board. And I think it's a struggle for some people to acknowledge that someone's had to face something, perhaps even more challenging than you have. Because my life is the hardest. And I think it's such a cop out, I think we just have to do better across the board. And I know you were saying kind people, but also mean people, mean trans people deserve care too.

But not mean women, I guess. They can be "educated" by the ideologues.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Deborah Frances-White: We need a massive rethink as a society. And feminism needs a big old rethink on this because if we are not there to protect the most vulnerable members of our group, what are we there for. As you said before Mridul, there is a social licence to treat trans people very badly, to rule them out of employment, to speak in rude ways about them, and to them, for street harassment, there's a social licence, we need to revoke that licence. It is the job of feminism to revoke that licence, and to step up, and step forward and say, these people are our sisters, these people are our siblings, and we need trans people to be protected. And we take that first step today. And if we have some discomfort because of the power structures that raised us, and that evolved us and evolved our thinking, that are in themselves structurally violent, then we need to do that work on ourselves, to get more comfortable with doing the right thing, and protecting kind people who want a break and desperately need a break from our society.

Kemah Bob:
I think it's a moment to check your privilege. And I think we've gotten to an interesting place in society where we're acknowledging the structural inequalities that women face across the board. And I think it's a struggle for some people to acknowledge that someone's had to face something, perhaps even more challenging than you have. Because my life is the hardest. And I think it's such a cop out, I think we just have to do better across the board. And I know you were saying kind people, but also mean people, mean trans people deserve care too.

Oh for gods sake. It's one thing to buy into transgenderism. It's quite another to imagine that a male who lied to get into a position where they are subsequently allowed to call rape victims bigots, is in any way the one who is marginalised.

She can centre men as much as she likes. What she can't do is call it feminism.

The biggest con in history is when men persuaded women that feminism is about men's rights.

It is the job of feminism to revoke that licence, and to step up, and step forward and say, these people are our sisters, these people are our siblings, and we need trans people to be protected

Sorry, DFW, I'm too busy stepping forward to try and protect my female sisters - who are dying at the hands of men at a rate of THREE A WEEK. Week in, week out, there are piles of dead women, and more traumatised and terrified women around them.

How many trans women have been murdered in Scotland since they started keeping records?

Oh yeah, none.

The trans women who have been murdered, and each one is a tragedy and a terrible loss for their friends and family, were all victims of crimes which were not fuelled by transphobia.

I dispute that the trans and NB population are the most vulnerable.

It's easy to see who is most vulnerable in the UK - just count the corpses to figure it out.

I've been unable to find any information regarding ERCCs governance on their website...
Who are the Board members?

She can centre men as much as she likes. What she can't do is call it feminism.

The biggest con in history is when men persuaded women that feminism is about men's rights.

Indeed.

I hope that if any woman gets raped, the most important thing she remembers is to always use the correct pronouns at all times. #lovewins

Kemah Bob:
I think it's a moment to check your privilege. And I think we've gotten to an interesting place in society where we're acknowledging the structural inequalities that women face across the board. And I think it's a struggle for some people to acknowledge that someone's had to face something, perhaps even more challenging than you have. Because my life is the hardest. And I think it's such a cop out, I think we just have to do better across the board. And I know you were saying kind people, but also mean people, mean trans people deserve care too.

Pointing out the trajectory of the argument here - the host has said that women must prioritize the TW because they're kind and they've suffered.

The response here is to start by calling women privileged and to conclude that we must not only prioritise the 'kind' transpeople but the mean transpeople, because transpeople deserve care too.

But obviously 'mean' women shouldn't expect quarter. And 'mean' women are the ones defined as not accepting males as women.

These 'feminists' are despicable people. They are as far from 'kind' as it is possible to get.

@GrimDamnFanjo

I've been unable to find any information regarding ERCCs governance on their website... Who are the Board members?

ESCC is both a charity & a company (this is very common)

Tje Scottish charity register doesn’t keep details of trustees (unlike the charity commission)

However companies house does

find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/SC291742/officers

Ah, got it, so its womens job to look after everybody, because of course they dont have any specific issues due to being women. This person is a very powerful TW who knows how to get exactly what they want, so I really dont think prioritising their needs comes first in the scheme of things.