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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Trans men fight back

100 replies

RoyalCorgi · 24/07/2021 14:22

Prominent trans men take on the autogynephiles.

www.gdalliancecanada.com/post/trans-men-fight-back

OP posts:
Binglebong · 25/07/2021 14:51

I find it puzzling that they didn't touch on straight boys and girls who still felt the need to trans. On my mind it is usually the expectations being put on them by the world, although there probably are some genuine GD. They are a smaller cohort, often autistic, and I don't want the forgotten about.

R0wantrees · 25/07/2021 15:17

GDAC
(extract)
"Gender Identity Disorder, now called Gender Dysphoria, used to be talked about quite openly in the LGB community and, whether or not we as lay people knew about Dr Blanchard’s Typology, clinicians understood that there were at least two different kinds of GD:

Homosexual type (which many lesbian and gay people experience and integrate into a gay/lesbian identity)

Autogynephilia, which only affects heterosexual men. It is a paraphilia in which a heterosexual orientation is inverted in such a way that the object of sexual desire is oneself as female."

www.gdalliancecanada.com/post/trans-men-fight-back

This is based on Ray Blanchard's typology following study of his male patients. Blanchard does not demonstrate interest or insight into female experiences.
Its a shame that a female-led group appear yet to recognise the extent of the sex based differences.

Bosky · 25/07/2021 19:29

R0wantrees I suspect that they are getting there, although it is definitely not directly addressed in their website content.

In yesterday's interview with Benjamin Boyce, Aaron Kimberley shows concern about the unexpected and phenomenal rise in girls and young women wanting medical treatment, explaining that this concern is a significant motivating factor in pushing back against proposed legislative changes to ban so-called "conversion therapy":

"Bullying in the Trans Community | with Aaron Kimberly"

Slythermum · 26/07/2021 01:31

Very courageous. All power to them!

EishetChayil · 26/07/2021 07:33

@Binglebong

I find it puzzling that they didn't touch on straight boys and girls who still felt the need to trans. On my mind it is usually the expectations being put on them by the world, although there probably are some genuine GD. They are a smaller cohort, often autistic, and I don't want the forgotten about.

There's a trans man YouTuber who very much fits this bill.

Binglebong · 26/07/2021 08:21

Thanks Eishnet. They are about, increasingly so, so it strange they were ignored in this otherwise excellent article.

R0wantrees · 26/07/2021 10:14

Binglebong Are those involved all same sex oriented?

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 26/07/2021 10:56

@MistyGreenAndBlue

Ovarian system 🌌Grin 😂😂 I shouldn't laugh really though. Just more misogyny isnt it? Internalised misogyny is still misogyny but I admit, this one tickled me.
Admiral Ackbar, Gold attack group on standby ...
Bosky · 26/07/2021 16:05

@R0wantrees

Binglebong Are those involved all same sex oriented?
I believe so. Some, like Aaron Kimberley, have posted articles on the site about their history as butch lesbians.

There are only a few personal stories on the site so far.

I wonder if the site is being attacked? Pages are not loading or are displaying an error message.

It would not surprise me now that a certain section of the Umbrella is trying to stick a spoke in their wheels!

Binglebong · 26/07/2021 16:47

Some are same sex attracted, some aren't ("gay" transmen).

334bu · 01/08/2021 16:39

Blog post has been removed. Is there an archive version?

Bosky · 01/08/2021 17:23

"Trans Men Fight Back" archived here: archive.md/l7xc1

Bosky · 01/08/2021 17:25

Most recent blog post, presumably relating to the deleted blog post:

"Clarification forthcoming"

We are grateful for the overwhelming support we've received, over the last several days in particular, and are listening to those who have offered constructive feedback as well. We are regrouping and will release a new statement to clarify our position.

Stay tuned....

www.gdalliancecanada.com/post/clarification-forthcoming

334bu · 01/08/2021 19:03

Thank you for that link Bosky. It would seem that the gender dysphoric are being very badly served by TRA.

FindTheTruth · 03/08/2021 14:16

Aaron talks with clarity...
"so the letter that i co-signed all it really said was that we object to a gender identity framework being used in the writing of international law and policy um
01:17
and i'm sure we all sign that for different reasons. my concern with it is that you know it's a philosophy, it's a philosophical way of understanding the nature of what it means to be transgender and to have gender dysphoria and it's not a philosophy that i personally agree with"

SmokedDuck · 03/08/2021 15:44

@Binglebong

I find it puzzling that they didn't touch on straight boys and girls who still felt the need to trans. On my mind it is usually the expectations being put on them by the world, although there probably are some genuine GD. They are a smaller cohort, often autistic, and I don't want the forgotten about.
Maybe they just felt they couldn't really speak to their experience?

I think that's how it should be really, rather than these block-lobbies that claim to speak on behalf of huge groups of people, like women or non-heterosexual people or black people or many other groups. We might group together with others we feel we have something in common with, to talk about our views and experiences in a public discussion, but we never represent everyone and shouldn't try to. What's important is that people get to contribute on the way to finding a way forward, even if in the end the decision doesn't go their way, it will hopefully have helped us find the best way forward.

As far as this "denying my existence" stuff. I think what people mean here is that others are denying their identity category. Since they see their identity as who they are, they see it as a denial of themselves.

It's a very unstable mental construct to hold up a persons' sense of self, but one that modern life seems to encourage in some way. It's pretty much the opposite of most ideologies and philosophies that look to root people more firmly, which suggest transcending categories like this is the way to stability.

FindTheTruth · 03/08/2021 16:58

It terrifies queer theory extremists when trans men and women are the voice of reason and agree with feminists. I guess it's because it undermines the silencing, cancelling and false accusations of transphobia.

FindTheTruth · 03/08/2021 17:04

Agree Smoked re the issue of "block-lobbies that claim to speak on behalf of huge groups of people".

and Interesting to hear trans men say that there are two completely different trans communities. Feminists have been saying this for years. Like Magdelene on YouTube saying that the issue is activists not trans people.

Binglebong · 03/08/2021 21:53

I'm glad they didn't try to speak for them. I just find it a little strange that they said there are two types instead of three, especially as the third seems to be increasing.

FindTheTruth · 05/08/2021 08:41

Trans men getting banned from twitter too now

FindTheTruth · 05/08/2021 09:01

TLDR: The trans men explain that there are different groups, including:

GROUP 1: Trans men and trans women with gender dysphoria who live and let live peacefully and do discuss sex. (Democracy)

GROUP 2: male heterosexual autogynephiles who demand you agree that sex doesn't exist, that discussing sex is 'literal violence'. (Theocracy)

FindTheTruth · 05/08/2021 09:02

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

334bu · 05/08/2021 09:08

Thanks for that link FindTheTruth. Eye opening.

FindTheTruth · 05/08/2021 09:24

Trans man suspended on twitter:
Scott Newgent. @ScottNewgent. "Probably going to get banned for a while on twitter, but I just had to say what everyone is thinking, someone has to say it"

FindTheTruth · 05/08/2021 09:27

@334bu

Thanks for that link FindTheTruth. Eye opening.
It is isn't it? not sure why it got deleted even after reading the guidelines again 🤷‍♀️
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