It's now on MSM - Laurel Hubbard

[highame]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/transgender-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard-in-eye-of-the-storm-at-toyko-olympics-zstnnk729

I saw last night that Al Jazeera had Laurel Hubbard in the strapline but didn't wait to see the news item. This now means it's worldwide and in countries where there would be very strong objections. I wonder how this will pan out

Anyone got a share token, it doesn't work on my laptop

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/12e56bae-e714-11eb-8a8d-0766fc17d1b5?shareToken=f12ff86e862bc217f36122f00152d3f6

Comments are turned off.

For Hubbard’s critics, however, it is not a question of whether or not she follows these rules. It is whether the rules make sense in the first place and, for some, whether they should be in place at all. Rightly or wrongly, Hubbard’s peformance in the women’s super-heavyweight category — which could well lead to a medal — will be one of the main talking points at Tokyo.

“The question is so complex we will probably never have an answer to it. What we have to do is look at solutions which provide the greatest number of people with the greatest confidence that it’s the right thing. At the moment, I don’t think we have that.”

a couple of quotes from the article. Comments have been turned off

You won't see the comments but this is the archive of the story (no share token involved):

For Hubbard’s critics, however, it is not a question of whether or not she follows these rules. It is whether the rules make sense in the first place and, for some, whether they should be in place at all. Rightly or wrongly, Hubbard’s peformance in the women’s super-heavyweight category — which could well lead to a medal — will be one of the main talking points at Tokyo.

Few people, if any, would argue that the regulations are perfect. The IOC has said it is developing new guidance on the issue. “Overall, the discussions, so far, have confirmed the considerable tension between the notions of fairness and inclusion, and the desire and need to protect the women’s category,” a spokesman said in a recent statement to CNN.

“These are incredibly complex, bio-psycho-social-cultural issues that [the IOC] are trying to tackle,” said Greg Whyte, an expert in sport physiology and former director of research for the British Olympic Association. “It polarises people.”

archive.is/3KNjk

Wow. Of all the issues in the world that really are huge and complex and need enormous efforts to settle fairly — this really is not one of them.

Men competing against women in sports are cheating.

It’s as easy as that.

I don’t really see why they are insisting on making it so complicated. “Bio-psycho-social-cultural issues” erm no. Just no men in women’s categories, however they choose to identify. Pretty simple really.

I don’t think the question is complex at all

I think that if all these sports bodies think fairness is so difficult then they should have Male, Female and mixed categories so everyone can take part ‘fairly’

Seems straightforward to me…

It's not complicated. If you have XY chromosomes you're competing in the men's category. Job done

tbh, I'm seeming precious little evidence of the desire and need to protect the women’s category - I'm seeing indifference to the prospect of undermining women's sports at relatively warp speed. Linda Blade's book is excellent at laying this out and her conversation with Boyce covers it well:

These are incredibly complex, bio-psycho-social-cultural issues that [the IOC] are trying to tackle

Ah bless’m! A simple look at a photo of Hubbard should clear up that troubling complexity.

It is simple. And by saying it's too complicated they are essentially saying they don't really care about women's sport.

Oh my god, it’s so complicated! On the one hand you have the integrity, fairness and safety of women’s sport which as a sports body is half of our remit. On the other hand, you have the risk of some people with penises feeling sad! Oh my god, what to do, what to do, there must be some reasonable compromise we can come to amidst all of this massive complexity tears hair out

Yeah, it's soooooooo complicated because it's 'only women's sport so it's not even that important'.

Last year, there was an article in the Times and I can't remember who wrote it but he was full on TWAW in sport. I wrote a comment about men making decisions about women in sport and his answer was that there was a woman at the top of the decision making - it happened to be a transwoman. My response was 'exactly'. There are those in sport who really do think men should compete against women and that it's fair. I wonder if they have ever actually thought about this - my guess is not

It only gets complicated if you’re trying to justify it.

Does anyone have a share token for this?

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/debates-over-laurel-hubbards-olympic-games-inclusion-must-accept-that-she-has-earned-right-to-compete-z2c7fzcc7

Thanks

#whataboutnina

"Her supporters believe she is paving the way for an inclusive future in sport and is an inspiration to young people from the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community across the world."
Transgender, perhaps, but probably not the others?....

It was a different article to the OP's but it was from a while ago so ignore anyway!

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ef6c59dc-d695-11eb-a220-6b7b44d7fe64?shareToken=58e0f893fa20881207044bdebfabfb69

Share token for the article @CrossPurposes posted

@PamDenick

#whataboutnina

Hasn't she had a 'special invitation' which allows her to participate?

@CrossPurposes

Does anyone have a share token for this?

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/debates-over-laurel-hubbards-olympic-games-inclusion-must-accept-that-she-has-earned-right-to-compete-z2c7fzcc7

Thanks

I posted the wrong one - that article had been archived previously and is available here: archive.is/nE7Vt

*'We need investment in research in order to get a better understanding of the decisions. Thirdly, it’s education. We have to better educate the general population and athletes to the nuances of the argument, instead of sensationalising and polarising it.

“The question is so complex we will probably never have an answer to it. What we have to do is look at solutions which provide the greatest number of people with the greatest confidence that it’s the right thing. At the moment, I don’t think we have that.”'*

Can the so-called experts PLEASE srop pretending that the question should men be allowed in women's sports? is a difficult one? The mantra twaw has a lot to answer for. It really seems to cloud people's brains.

Can the so-called experts PLEASE srop pretending that the question should men be allowed in women's sports? is a difficult one? The mantra twaw has a lot to answer for. It really seems to cloud people's brains.

It's not the power of the mantra tho', is it? It's the underlying reality of the reputational harms and professional/social ostracism that will come to the person who addresses the heart of the matter that has been so well expressed by several posters here.